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  #1  
Old March 31st, 2001, 02:01 AM
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Suicide Junkie Suicide Junkie is offline
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Default Re: Balck Holes too soft

quote:
Here is a question for you--could our sun become a black hole?

Yes. Even Earth would become a black hole if you squeezed it down to the size of a marble (1 cm)
Will it happen naturally? Not a chance.

quote:
A black hole has a huge mass right? So if a ship tried to orbit it, would it take lots of energy to remain in orbit?


To remain in orbit takes zero energy. Just take a look at the sun/earth/moon.

It may take a lot of energy to get into orbit from the surface, but once you're there you're there for good until you hit something, or generate thrust.

quote:
1. A spacecraft the size of the shuttle approaches our sun on a course aimed directly for the 'center' of the star.
2. Take the main engines used to achieve escape velocity out of the equation.
3. Assume the spacecraft doesn't use any fuel until it reaches closest approach.
4. Assume that heat/radiation aren't a factor--robotic pilot if you want.
How close do you think the spacecraft can get to our sun before it must alter its course to try to enter an orbit around the star?


The key to getting an orbit is to have a mass whose gravitational well you happen to be in.
The Intrepid Space Pilot in your question happens to be in an orbit already, its just that that orbit happens to pass through the surface of the star In order to stay in orbit, all the spacecraft must do is miss the star. To do that, the spacecraft need only dodge sideways one star-radius. It will then skim past the edge & go flying out, slow, fall back, and zing past the opposite edge.

Now, lets say you want to orbit an object that's 30,000Km wide. Since we are heading straight for it at the moment we must move sideways 15,000Km before we hit. If our ship is one second from impact, we must accelerate to 0.1c (10% the speed of light) in one second, then we can cut engines and be in orbit.
By accelerating to 30,000Km, in one second, we average 15,000Km/s, and in the one second before we hit, we've slid one star radius to the side, and fly past.

If we are nice and far away, such as near pluto's orbit, then we will have weeks to months before we reach the (30,000Km)"sun" (light takes 7 hours to get to pluto, and we're not going to be going anywhere near lightspeed)
divide the 15,000Km by 2 months, and we have:
quote:
No-calculator math time:
2 months= 60 days
=60*24 = 1200+240 = 1440 hours
=1500 x 60 = 60000+3000 minutes
=60000 x 60 = 3,600,000 seconds
15,000km / 3,600,000 seconds
=15 km / 3,600 s
= 15 /3.6 m/s
= about 5 m/s
= Jogging Speed.


So, even a ship without engines coud merely open a door & vent some atmosphere, to get a boost to that speed.

All you have to do is scoot sideways the width of your target & you're in orbit. Very Hot & Very cold at times, but an orbit nonetheless.
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  #2  
Old March 31st, 2001, 04:02 AM
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Default Re: Balck Holes too soft

Thanks!

Stupid Sci-Fi shows should try to be a bit more accurate about black holes.
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Old March 31st, 2001, 05:37 AM

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Default Re: Balck Holes too soft

Excellent SCI-FI book -

Light of Other days
by Arthur C. Clarke, Stephen Baxter http://images.amazon.com/images/P/08...1.LZZZZZZZ.jpg
Its about wormholes. Fascinating read.

[This message has been edited by AJC (edited 31 March 2001).]
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Old March 31st, 2001, 10:57 AM

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Default Re: Balck Holes too soft

Sheesh next time I need a lesson in orbital mechanics for a sci-fi roleplaying game or a piece of fan fic, I'll remember to ask here. <G>
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Old April 2nd, 2001, 02:01 PM
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Default Re: Balck Holes too soft

<Red Dwarf>
Thing about space, right, is it's black. And the thing about black holes, right, is they're black. So how you meaent to see 'em then?
</Red dwarf>


Sorry, it was all getting beyond me=-)

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Old April 2nd, 2001, 04:27 PM
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Default Re: Balck Holes too soft

I just watches four episodes of Star Blazers yesterday. Their mission is to travel around 200,000 light years in less than a year. That's a pretty good distance considering that ST:V'Gr is gonna take around 70 years to travel just 70,000. Oh, I just figured it out. They made their first space warp from the moon to Mars and covered several thousand light years. :-)
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  #7  
Old April 2nd, 2001, 06:02 PM

Sirkit Sirkit is offline
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Default Re: Balck Holes too soft

black holes are tecnically a pain in the *** to detect, but in the case of light if matter was caught in the accreation disc you could see it and then recognize the fact that a dense peiec of matter was at the center (ie. a black hole) BTW listen to Suicide_Junkie for the most part hes right
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