Finding major problems

[Dweeb]

Here's a quote from the manual:
"Simultaneous Games work a little different than Turn-Based games. Every player takes their turn at the same time as the other players (if on different machines). Players can only give orders to their ships, they will not move. Movement for all players is executed at the same time after all of the players have taken their turns. Combat which occurs is resolved automatically by the computer and no Tactical Combat is allowed."

It's not a bug, it's the only logical way it can work.

[-Thog-]

Understood. However, I was under the impression that simultanious movement would have a combat replay feature. This way you can see what happened when the computer resolved the combat. THAT is the only way to get any idea what weapons worked, what didn't and why.

So the lack of the replay feature severely impacts the utility of the simultaneous movement system. Since you haven't the foggest idea what happened (except that you won or lost), you have no way to really improve your approach or designs. In that case, why bother with complex ship designs? After all, you'll never know if it made any difference.

I still haven't found anything in the paper manual or on-line that indicates that the combat replay feature is disabled in Simultaneous mode. I fact, I can't find that quote in the paper manual at all (though it is in the on-line Version).

I also noticed a comment in the Online manual that; "For some things, this is instantaneous such as transferring cargo or renaming something". This is true of renaming, but does not appear to be true of cargo. That seems to wait till the next turn.

Thog

[KillerManJaro]

I dunno, Thog. If these issues are enough for you to consign this title to the shelf, what on Earth do you play? Seems to me to be pretty paltry issues, given that turn based works fine.....

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KMJ

[Taqwus]

Don't forget the combat simulator, given that IIRC you always get the other side's ship designs after combat. There, you can test [most things*] to your heart's content.


* At least in the demo, starbases, planets and ships didn't necessarily start anywhere near each other. Makes it harder to test multiple battlestations defending a world.

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-- The thing that goes bump in the night

[Malfador Machinations]

To everyone who has found problems:

Don't worry, there's a patch coming next week!

Be sure to email us with anything you have encountered.

Aaron

[Dweeb]

quote:

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Originally posted by KillerManJaro:
I dunno, Thog. If these issues are enough for you to consign this title to the shelf, what on Earth do you play? Seems to me to be pretty paltry issues, given that turn based works fine.....

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Yes, but my main interest in SE4 is in simultaneous-turn multiplay (I hope a lot of other people are interested too!) I agree it would be really nice to have a combat-replay feature. I don't know if it was promised or not.

[-Thog-]

Sorry for delay, machine bought it.

Well, as it turns out I am enjoying turn based enough to keep playing (remember I said I hadn't gotten to it yet and didn't know). It's a good game with some very solid design elements, some really annoying bugs, and an interface that is about 75% 'there'. But as I said, simultaneous mode has major problems.

Dweebs comment is spot on, in that I'm looking at SE4 as a replacement for VGAP, Stars and VGAP4 (which I think became vaporware). That's not practical in turn-based, and simultaneous has just enough shortcomings to make it not worth the effort. Don't read this as "SE4 isn't worth the effort and sucks". That isn't what I'm saying. It's just got a few shortcomings with major impact that need to be corrected. True of many games on first release.

Interface short list:
* Ability to sort planets by "Only My Empire".
* Ability to select a system in Planets Display and have it show only planets/contruction sites in that system.
* Ability to say "Send colony ship" without opening a new window and having to scroll around looking for the planet you've just identified in the Planet Display.
* Ability to choose which colony ship from a list.
Use the right-click for some of these perhaps?

Simultaneous short list:
* Ability to set formations, battle plans etc. (This may exist, but doesn't show up, because...)
* Ability to replay a recording of a battle. I want to see what happened in that fight where my 2nd Fleet got wiped out.

Aaron, thanks for the support. You folks seem to have a good rep with your players, and you have a good (and reasonably stable) design. My concerns with the interface are a result of playing it allot for a couple evenings (where seemingly minor things start to chafe). My concerns with simultaneous play are simply that without a replay feature the game loses a very large chunk of functionality, in that the whole point to these games for many folks is to see the USS Spoon smash the other guy in the head.

Thog