Is the price of Dominions II a deterrent?

[Watchdog]

I fail to understand what is so difficult to grasp about my position. My complaint is simple. I want this game, but I feel like the company's business practice's are unethical. This forces me to pass the product by even though I'd really like to play it. I won't because I refuse to patronize a company that uses cdkeys and charges so much for a 2nd rate product.

Let me explain. I want to play this game. But not as much as I want to play, say, age of wonders shadow magic. From there the math and logic are simple.

Shadow magic works just fine on my lan without any cdkey nonsense so I can play it with my girlfriend. It cost less than 35 dollars.

More use, more fun, less cost. Shadow magic wins. So even though Dom is cool, they lost me with their business ethics.

I do not feel like they should make a profit based on individual solely. Over the internet, sure. But in one's own home with one's family?

Do you really think that is just? To treat a family like it's some corporation with multiple licenses of say, office for word processing?

See, company's make money, so do universities and governments. These are profit based organizations, (please, don't make me argue that point I've seen plenty of examples of both of the later institutions ledgers) they make money.

They make money using another company's software. Since they are profiting from another's company's software there is justice in the idea that the company should pay for multiple licenses.

My household makes no profit. Simply put, although I enjoy games they are a leisure activity. I don't make any money from them. Therefore, to suggest that using multiple instances to get the maximum enjoyment from my game is worth purchasing multiple licenses, NO!

BTW, hot seat sucks. Most company's have mothballed this feature. Waste of time.

[Graeme Dice]

Originally posted by Watchdog:
More use, more fun, less cost. Shadow magic wins. So even though Dom is cool, they lost me with their business ethics.

Then provide a mechanism whereby it is possible to prevent others (anyone not in your family) from using your copy of Dom2, while at the same time allowing others (anyone in your family) to play the game. Also note that most games that do not force you to play on only one comptuer still have clauses in their licenses that only allow you to play on one computer at a time.

I'm not really seeing why people are complaining about the price anyways, considering that it's right in the middle of normal prices for just-released games. In fact, it's cheaper than the average new release, at $58 CDN, while most sit at $69 CDN or more.

[blackwulf]

Originally posted by Watchdog:
I fail to understand what is so difficult to grasp about my position.

I feel that your position is unrealistic. Additionally the focus of your position has changed. Originally before you discovered that you need to purchase additional copies to play lan games you were simply appalled at the price. Now the major focal point of your reply is that they dare to require that each player own a copy of the game.

It seems that you want them to knock $10-$15 off the game and allow you and all your friends/family to play multiplayer lan games for free. There is nothing wrong with feeling this way. However to wish that someone goes out of business because they don’t agree with your demands is a bit much don’t you think?

Originally posted by Watchdog:
I refuse to patronize a company that uses cdkeys and charges so much for a 2nd rate product.

.

Why would you want to purchase a 2nd rate product at any price?

Originally posted by Watchdog:
These are profit based organizations, (please, don't make me argue that point I've seen plenty of examples of both of the later institutions ledgers) they make money. .

.

So because you have seen the ledgers of a few companies that have made profits you can infer from this that all businesses are making money?

Originally posted by Watchdog:
BTW, hot seat sucks. Most company's have mothballed this feature. Waste of time. .

.

While I do agree that hot seat is not my favorite . I feel that some people might actually be happy with the option. Simply because it is of no use to you does not make it a waste of time to include.

-blackwulf

[ November 04, 2003, 07:34: Message edited by: blackwulf ]

[PvK]

Originally posted by Watchdog:
I fail to understand what is so difficult to grasp about my position. My complaint is simple. I want this game, but I feel like the company's business practice's are unethical. This forces me to pass the product by even though I'd really like to play it. I won't because I refuse to patronize a company that uses cdkeys and charges so much for a 2nd rate product.

Let me explain. I want to play this game. But not as much as I want to play, say, age of wonders shadow magic. From there the math and logic are simple. ...

I understand. If you like Doms II less than AOW, play AOW. Different players like different games. I believe Shrapnel when they say they need to sell it at $45 based on their costs and business model.

More importantly, my tastes are the reverse of yours in this case. To me, AOW2 is a marginal product, which I wouldn't pay more than about $10 for, while to me, Doms I and II are the best (and really, the only) games of their type. To me, they're worth $45, or even $30 for the one and $45 for the second (plus shipping, etc). I'll be playing the heck out of them, so they'll be great deals for me, which no other game can substitute for.

Anyway, I understand where you're coming from. Stick with what you like. Hopefully though, you can appreciate that some of us think the Doms games are unique, excellent, and well worth the price Shrapnel needs to charge for them.

PvK

[Tim Brooks]

Watchdog:

You may not like our business practices in respect to software piracy and pricing, but you've got to respect us for letting you come into our 'home', use our bandwidth - which, by the way, is paid for partially by the money we make off of Dominions II - and express your wishes that you hope we go out of business, that our games are second rate, and that our business practices stink.

Also, if we didn't offer copy protection, our license would still only allow you to use the software on one computer at a time. I don't know of one game publisher that doesn't have a license stating this. So your objection is quite hollow, as to play mulit-player, even in your home, would require multiple copies.

[Jasper]

Originally posted by Tim Brooks:
Also, if we didn't offer copy protection, our license would still only allow you to use the software on one computer at a time. I don't know of one game publisher that doesn't have a license stating this.

I agree with you in general, and think the pricing is fine; why should the best game in it's genre come at a discount?! Moreover those saying the price should be lower have only opinion to back up their claims, which seems rather pale to me in comparison to practical experience.

Still, it's worth pointing out that there is a rather prominent exception to your blanket statement -- Warcraft 2. This let 3 players play in a multiplayer game per CD, but you needed a cd for solo play. IMHO this was a wise move, and probably contributed to Warcraft's popularity and Blizzard's ascension.

Admitedly Warcraft is the sort of game this tactic is perfect for, and Dominions probably isn't...

[Watchdog]

I'll just make one more point and then I'll leave off the topic. In my defense I originally posted with such energy because it looked like the price might actually be re-assigned once shrap saw that many people were posting about not buying the game because it's price to high. I was wrong.

My Last point is this. Software eula's have yet to be tested in court. They look very impressive but many of them contain several fictions that won't stand up if a judge gets involved. That being the case I tend to take their edict with a grain of salt. I don't pirate because I think it's stealing. But installing multiple instances or making backups(this is also prohibited by some licenses I've seen) are things that I will do regardless of whatever licensing stipulations I click on to install the game without actually agreeing to.

Anyway, Last bit from me. Have fun with your game.


PS.. "offer" copy protection......... lol that's a funny way to put it.

[ November 05, 2003, 13:16: Message edited by: Watchdog ]