CherryMod Thread

[Saber Cherry]

Originally posted by LordArioch:
I thought of some interesting themes to suggest...but I think you already have them.
Pangea: All animal units, maybe werewolf mages...DRAGONFLY SCOUTS!!!

Yeah I've been thinking along those lines as well. Some sort of "Gaia", "Devolution", or "Return to Nature" theme, with no human units except druids. And inverted cavalry, where miniature ponies charge into battle riding specially-bred human linebackers. Centaurs and Satyrs might still be tolerated, but there would be mostly "Battle Bunnies", "Squirrel Soldiers", and "Mousie Militia". National heroes would include the Vorpal Bunny of Death from Monty Python's Holy Grail, and of course the immortal Coyote from Roadrunner cartoons. He'd start out feebleminded, though.

Ok, seriously - I've been giving a theme like this some thought, and it's hard for me to figure out how the economics would work out. Why would animals want gold, and with no tools, what would resources do? I want it to be nature versus humanity, so it would include vine ogres and vinemen in addition to animals, but they don't care about that stuff either. I like the dragonfly scouts=)

Hmm... the best way for it to work would be to make animals and vine-creatures spontaneously arise in provinces with high dominion and high magic, and allow the Pangea "Nature" theme to take turmoil, sloth, and unluck (require +3 magic and at least +2 turmoil). But, alternately, it could have intelligent talking animals that want to be paid for their services and wear armor (just not leather armor).

Anyway, non-humanoid themes require a bit more work and thought than more standard themes.

P.S.

By Graeme
It would be interesting to have a "Kingdom of the dead" though, where they go about living their lives like normal people

Perhaps you mean "undying their undeaths"?

Yes, I'm going to put in a theme like that. Zombies have figured out how to make baby zombies, and etc. This theme would be best if province population could go negative, to represent a bustling undead population.

[ November 24, 2003, 19:32: Message edited by: Saber Cherry ]

[Mind Elemental]

Just making sure -- that Japan theme would be for Tien Chi, right?

[Saber Cherry]

Originally posted by Mind Elemental:
Just making sure -- that Japan theme would be for Tien Chi, right?

Unfortunately, I think so. It would be fun for Tien Chi and Japan to fight, but it makes more sense to make Japan a Tien Chi theme than a theme for anyone else. Though I've been considering Man too.

[Saber Cherry]

Some preliminary infantry rebalancing thoughts... I'm making the assumption that all humans are different, and the strong ones are given heavy armor, the agile ones are trained as light infantry, and cheap militia is weak, poorly fed, untrained rabble. Non-professional soldiers have low mental discipline and thus low MR, and morale increases with armor and wages. Both of those would increase MY morale. Also, armor interferes with precision and ability to swing weapons accurately.

____... PS LM MM LI MI HI HE LA HA

RES_... 2 3 10 9 15 99 99 6 99
PROT... 1 5 9 8 12 99 99 6 99
GP__... 3 4 6 8 10 12 14 8 10
SUP_... 6 7 8 10 15 20 20 10 15
HP__... 7 8 9 10 10 11 12 9 10
STR_... 8 8 9 10 10 11 11 10 10
ATT_... 6 8 9 11 10 9 10 8 9
DEF_... 7 8 9 11 10 9 10 8 9
MRST... 9 9 9 10 10 10 11 10 10
MRL_... 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 8 9
PREC... 8 8 9 10 9 8 9 11 10
ENC_... 5 5 4 3 3 3 3 3 3
MP__... 1 1 1 2 2 1 1 2 1
AP__... 7 8 9 12 12 12 12 12 12

This is much more clear in the Excel chart, if anyone can host it. These are my preliminary infantry rebalancing thoughts, for rebalancing the base units (on top of which armor/weapons are added). Essentially, these will be basic guidelines - not an "All heavy elite infantry will have these stats" thing. I'd prefer to do stat modifications in the equipment, though.

Translations:

PS=Peasant/Slave
LM/MM=Militia
LI/MI/HI=Infantry
HE=Heavy Elite
LA/HA=Archers

RES, PROT: The maximum values for resources and protection to be considered within this "class".

GP, SUP: The gold cost and supply usage for a unit in this "class". This is not just what the soldier eats, but his entourage, transport, and repair supply considerations as well.

If you have any comments, suggestions, questions, or just can't read the **** thing, feel free to tell me=)

[ November 26, 2003, 05:57: Message edited by: Saber Cherry ]

[LordArioch]

It might help if you tried to add spaces to line up the numbers. Also why are the HI 99 prot? I assume you just mean some high value in general?

EDIT: Oh 99 is a maximum. Just goes to show you can never expect ignorant people like me to read carefully through a whole post before replying to it. It's truely a sad world.

[ November 26, 2003, 07:57: Message edited by: LordArioch ]

[Keir Maxwell]

I'm making the assumption that all humans are different, and the strong ones are given heavy armor, the agile ones are trained as light infantry,

In alot of societies how a soldier fights is determined by social factors more than individual capabilites. Some societies make a more conscious use of their resources and but most are at least as much driven by social standing. Even with Rome it is argued that after a certain date the Praetorian Guard cease to be an elite unit in reality due to the degree of corruption and nepotism involved.

Cheers

Keir

[Endoperez]

About the animal theme, what if they ONLY required resources? Like, wolves costing 1 gp/10 res, and bears 1gp/30 res? The problem comes with castles... If fortress could be replaced with a temple for this theme, it would be good. But a fortress (den? homely cave?) with a building time of 1/cost of 150, no defence rating and no walls inside would work too, if we can mod these things.
But animals would be quite weak versus archers, and most players would just recruit indies for that reason. They do have money... Even with population-killing dominion. Well, the druids would take most of that money, and buildings.

And how would vine men, and nature magic, fit in? Animals/vine men? Vine men with some equipment? A national hero Fenris the Great Wolf, leading an army with Gift of Reasoned Vine Ogre wearing Fenris pelt? Maybe blocking (the creation of) certain items should be considered. Maybe Malrus the Son of Fenris?

Just some weird ideas... It's nice to read all this, but all these things won't fit in one mod.

EDIT: can a unit have a cost of zero?

[ November 26, 2003, 10:45: Message edited by: Endoperez ]