Racial Specific Pretenders (Limitations)

[Saber Cherry]

Originally posted by Nerfix:
I have found myself using immobiles lately. The Void Lurker of R'lyeh is about the best pretender they can get, and i still think that scales are rather important. He gets two attacks, is ethereal and has a poison cloud effect(iirc) and costs hefty 0 points.

But i do find it srange that Oracles can't scry...

Their archmage is also zero points, but can be used to sitesearch underwater... or with an amulet of fish, on land, too. Not a bad deal! The disadvantages are weak astral and low HP (assassination, seeking arrow).

But who cares how many attacks an immobile pretender gets? I really don't see that as ever being important.

[Keir Maxwell]

Originally posted by Zen:
Maybe what I'm missing is the use of the "Arch-mage" type of Pretenders. Does everyone use them from time to time?

I find their low Domininon unattractive and the lowered stats (especially HP) a deterant.

I am warming to rainbow mages in Dom2. I am quite happy to have my pretender as capable researcher, site searcher, item maker, even when they have SC stats. The SC Versions will do a bit of conquering here and there but that is more a bonus than anything. I have never much liked magic rich Super combatent Pretenders - you may well lose them and half their magic. The only reason I use them in Dom2 is because they are generally the cheapest chassis for a bless effect god.

At present I'm taking "Master Liu" the Great Sage with Tien Ch'i. 21 research points (race has a -3drain scale to help pay) and excellent site searching - which is a big thing in game with 60%+ magic sites. The race design has problems but I'm coming to suspect this is in part due to bread and butter issues like the troops Tien Ch'i get not being that great. Still main theme is far from a pauper like the two Tien Ch'i sub-themes.

It would be nice if the special rainbow mages for races like Abysia, Jotun and Caelum cost a little more and started with a higher dominion. At present its too expensive to get a rainbow mage for a race needing high dominion.

cheers

Keir

[ December 02, 2003, 08:24: Message edited by: Keir Maxwell ]

[PDF]

Originally posted by Zen:
***** Queen is like a slightly improved Arch-Mage. Which isn't saying alot.

I'd always take a ***** Queen over an Archmage if I had the option, though I don't know if I'd take the ***** Queen as Man, but maybe as Vanheim.

40 Cost, 1 Dominion, 0 Magic Picks, 10 Pick per new.

Decent stats and calls 'wolves' to battle with her.

The Arco and 3 other Races that are allowed the Natarajah are not what I'm talking about .

Skratti is like a big Arch-mage. 50 Cost, 1 Dominion, 0 Magic Picks, 10 Pick per new.

Maybe what I'm missing is the use of the "Arch-mage" type of Pretenders. Does everyone use them from time to time?

I find their low Domininon unattractive and the lowered stats (especially HP) a deterant.

Their biggest problem is the low Dominion, and now (in Dom2) their little (if at all..) Bless effect. So they are more usable for races that doesn't need high dominions and have few (or no) blessed troops - Ulm and Arco for example
But low HP isn't an issue when you just don't plan to ever fight
A rainbow mage is used for research, site search, casting of rituals and item construction from all the paths, not combat. They start with avg 2 levels in each path, but can get to 4-5 with items and a little empowerement.

In fact I prefer to play a RB over a trampling monster, maybe that's a MoM heritage !

[Treebeard]

Rainbow Pretenders like the great sage and such are very nice until they get shot by an arrow coming from nowhere

Too risky, imho.

[Sammual]

You can't play a Pretender that doesn't have any HP. They can be killed via a luck strike from any number of spells. The AI does it to me in the late game and other players do it to me in the middle game.

Sammual

[Nerfix]

Originally posted by Saber Cherry:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Nerfix:
I have found myself using immobiles lately. The Void Lurker of R'lyeh is about the best pretender they can get, and i still think that scales are rather important. He gets two attacks, is ethereal and has a poison cloud effect(iirc) and costs hefty 0 points.

But i do find it srange that Oracles can't scry...

Their archmage is also zero points, but can be used to sitesearch underwater... or with an amulet of fish, on land, too. Not a bad deal! The disadvantages are weak astral and low HP (assassination, seeking arrow).

But who cares how many attacks an immobile pretender gets? I really don't see that as ever being important.

---

R'lyeh gets mages with randoms and has a great acces to Acashic Record. The 0-cost Archmage is weak, starts with weak dominion, you'll have to pay yourself sick to get 2 in all the paths, and if you want more, you pay more wich drains design points that are sorely needed for scales and dominion strength. RB's seem to be even more weaker than they were in Dom I... Too bad, i realy love RB's.

OTOH, i constantly use RB's with vanilla Ulm.

The amount of attacks(or lack of them) with a immobile pretender is quite important because the immobile pretender can defend itself from the enemy attacks if he has attacks(apart from spells). The Void Lurker even gets a poison cloud effect(iirc)!

[Teraswaerto]

Originally posted by Sammual:
You can't play a Pretender that doesn't have any HP. They can be killed via a luck strike from any number of spells. The AI does it to me in the late game and other players do it to me in the middle game.

Sammual

There are ways to protect him/her from just about any attack. Guided Arrow? Amulet of Missile Protection. Earth Attack? Tough bodyguards. The list goes on... Also, any assassination spell can also be guarded against by moving around with a stack of dummy targets (scouts, priests, etc). Elemental resistances and MR protect against spells of mass destruction, and having Retreat as the first order helps against sudden attacks from stealthy armies or troop-sending spells.