Question for the Developers?

Pirateiam · #1 February 17th, 2004, 07:45 PM

Actually I think small publishers like Shrapnel Games do a great job of supporting thier developers (Where more of the money goes back to the developers where it should!). What I think Illwinter needs is to develop this full time and with some help. It is amazing that they have pulled this off doing this part time. Could you imagine this game with them doing it full time with a small staff helping them??

[ February 17, 2004, 17:48: Message edited by: Pirateiam ]

vanedor · #2 February 17th, 2004, 09:04 PM

Amen Pirate, amen

En Forcer · #3 February 17th, 2004, 10:22 PM

There are other distributors out there who are better to deal with.

I would say my first pic for Indie game distribution would be Matrix games. They have established themselves as a quality outfit.

And D2 would complement their theme/genre direction very nicely.

Tim Brooks · #4 February 17th, 2004, 11:08 PM

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My question is - Has any larger publisher/developer approached you guys on developing this game further?

It amazes me that so many people think this is the way to make money. Large publishers don't pay great royalties. I designed and developed 5 games at retail with large publishers. Space Empires IV has earned the developer more in royalties than I made off 5 games through large publishers. Dominions II is on that same track. That is why I started Shrapnel Games - so developers could make money.

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Remember that a big publisher also typically means an even smaller share per sold unit to the developers. Unless you can count on massively increased sales, going to a big publisher can actually end up costing you money despite increased market penetration.

Oh so true. The truth is, to get Dominions II the numbers at retail to make even the kind of money we pay would require the game being 'dumbed down' - it's 'too' much of a strategy game.

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Depends on whether the publisher is willing (unlikely as that is) to front the devs some money to improve their product(s) and/or to develop new products.

Most definitely they would. This is how they make sure they own the code and don't have to pay large royalties. Of course they would ask for less depth too.

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Actually I think small publishers like Shrapnel Games do a great job of supporting thier developers (Where more of the money goes back to the developers where it should!).

Thank you!

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I would say my first pic for Indie game distribution would be Matrix games. They have established themselves as a quality outfit.

Then why are so many of their developers jumping ship? The ones that have contacted us haven't even received royalty payments on time and have said they would never do another game with Matrix. Are you a developer with them? I would like to know how you have this knowledge.

moodgiesanta · #5 February 17th, 2004, 11:52 PM

I'm all for Shrapnel Games, myself. This game, aside from the graphics (which are functional and pretty decent in that respect but not Halflife 2 by any means) doesn't feel independant. I think a game such as this would not do well on the big market. Europa Universalis got a sequel, which is an absolute blessing IMO, so I'm thinking it sold OK at least, or had very low costs, since it was essentially a translation for release over here in the US, but I'm not sure how much the developers got out of that. Besides, the documentation for that game was awful, the packagin unimpressing. Post release support has been pretty good, though, which to me is important. A lot of developers stop getting paid for the product after they end development, and aren't paid any more for patches. This game feels like a work of passion, too.

This hasn't been the most coherent of Posts, but hey. If it works for them, cool, because as incredible quality games like this one keep coming from ol' Shrapnel games and the games get coverage from various media, perhaps Shrapnel's business model will be seen as viable, inducing more indie productions and more companies in the field.

En Forcer · #6 February 18th, 2004, 12:06 AM

Tim,

That is interesting to know that developers are jumping ship from Matrix.

I did not know this and have based my opinion on the quality of Matrix from the viewpoint of a consumer and also from chats on their forums (which may have been more pro-Matrix for obvious reasons...)

Well, if they are all jumping ship, maybe you can send a press kit to the folks still on their roster?

I don't know too much about how you run Shrapnel but it sounds like you care and are a gamer as well as a businessman. Passion for the industry is all I can ask for and I'm confident that combination will deliver a superior product at a good price and I'll be happy and the developers will too!

Good luck and here's to all the success you can eat.

Peter Ebbesen · #7 February 18th, 2004, 12:36 AM

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Originally posted by moodgiesanta:
I think a game such as this would not do well on the big market. Europa Universalis got a sequel, which is an absolute blessing IMO, so I'm thinking it sold OK at least, or had very low costs, since it was essentially a translation for release over here in the US, but I'm not sure how much the developers got out of that. Besides, the documentation for that game was awful, the packagin unimpressing. Post release support has been pretty good, though, which to me is important.

"Pretty Good"??? Paradox is still releasing patches with feature upgrades more than two years after EU2 was published. That is not just "pretty good", that is exceptional.