Vampire Queens and Sneaking Armies

Taqwus · #1 April 14th, 2004, 01:26 AM

The infamous Bogus the Troll Raider is substantially nastier than most non-unique independents (Bloodhenge Druids could perhaps be nasty if they get lucky with Bleed, say). The combination of good prot, high base hp, good combat stats, a wraith sword and good regeneration is harsh if you merely melee him with living troops.

Hm. Should vampires be ethereal? I'm not sure what source that would be based on, and it's a substantial boost against indies conveniently lacking magic weapons. Take that away, perhaps give them a 'change shape' order (wolf? bat?) if one must, *shrug*.

AhhhFresh · #2 April 14th, 2004, 01:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Graeme Dice:
Put an elemental armor on her, and minor magic resist equipment, and then just about the only thing that has a chance to hurt her is death magic. You can give her afflictions by cursing her and using very buff tramplers, but she'll get better in just a few turns.

There is nothing that you can put on her that can protect her from AP x3 Undead damage... unless invulnerability ignores AP effects? I can never find my manual when I need it *grumble*...

Graeme Dice · #3 April 14th, 2004, 01:45 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by AhhhFresh:
Basically, you are just saying that
However, that can be acomplished by a number of pretender templates... either through magic or items (though the immortality + full items slots is hard to beat).

Impossible to beat, since there's no way to put as many modifiers on any other pretender chassis. She doesn't need a ring of regen, flying boots, life drain weapon, robe or the robe of shadows at all, whereas those all take up a slot on any other pretender.

Quote:

She's the fastest out of the gate whooping it up with Indie 9s really early... but I don't think this is a problem, because somebody has to be... why not the VQ?

She's immortal, which means that she can take just about any risks you want her to.

Quote:

So take away her misc slots. See how popular she is.

That wouldn't change much, since she doesn't really _need_ the AMA, and she already has inherent regeneration, so the other slot usually goes for a luck pendant.

Graeme Dice · #4 April 14th, 2004, 01:47 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by AhhhFresh:
There is nothing that you can put on her that can protect her from AP x3 Undead damage...

The Flambeau is only available to the nations with fire 3, and you still need to put it on something that can hit her through a defense of more than 20 and multiple mirror images, while not dying to the soul vortex and breath of winter or her own attacks.

archaeolept · #5 April 14th, 2004, 01:59 AM

Quote:

There is nothing that you can put on her that can protect her from AP x3 Undead damage... unless invulnerability ignores AP effects? [/QB]

a good SC loaded up can have 35 or 40 defense.

good luck w/ your flambeaus. and, of course, a high-level mirror-image, w/ luck, will stop most of those very few hits which get through.

[ April 14, 2004, 01:01: Message edited by: archaeolept ]

Graeme Dice · #6 April 14th, 2004, 02:03 AM

Then of course, if she has both death 3 and fire 2 then you really can't kill her without very specific troops and spell selection. Soul vortex and phoenix pyre provide esentially unlimited ressurrections.

AhhhFresh · #7 April 14th, 2004, 02:07 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Graeme Dice:

quote:
Originally posted by AhhhFresh:
There is nothing that you can put on her that can protect her from AP x3 Undead damage...

The Flambeau is only available to the nations with fire 3, and you still need to put it on something that can hit her through a defense of more than 20 and multiple mirror images, while not dying to the soul vortex and breath of winter or her own attacks.

True. Only Fire 3, which is a pain to get if you don't have it, since most of the easy addition items occur at Fire 3... except for the Skull of Fire... and other pretty specialized items (Ring of Wizardry, Staff of Elemental Mastery) which require Con 6 and have high reqs.

But the point about hitting through high defense and mirror images? I'm not sure I get that... obviously, you'd be sending in SC's to do this job... armed with a weapon that is magic, AP, and x3 damage... so the etherealness and armor go out the window... so she's got itty bitty hp that you can divide by 1/3...

Hey, I don't know... I have yet to encounter the "uber vampire queen" in an MP game... I've only used her myself to abuse the AI in SP games...

But frankly I'd like my chances if I had a pretender Void Lord equiped with a Flambeu...