Humanoid Pretenders are too expensive

[sergex]

I also agree that lots of pretenders are underpowered and thus not used in competitive play. I think if all pretenders were given recuperation then Immortality won't be as overpowered as it is now. Other than that, a total overhaul and rebalancing of costs and powers with MP in mind and not costing them in terms of roleplaying flavor would be helpful. The only problem is that the devs don't have much experience in MP it seems so it would be nice if they would host their own polls and discussions to arrive at a conclusion.

I really don't think they should leave it up to modders to balance pretenders.

[Cainehill]

Something else that might help balance immortality would be to slightly diminish the death penalty for non-immortals. Instead of all paths being reduced by one, maybe _half_ the paths being reduced by one, randomly determined. Or restoring a path costs half what the normal empowerment does, or reducing a path to 0 takes 2 deaths (thus allowing someone to empower up to 2 and start the clock ticking again).

Alternatively: Make "real" death for immortals worse; it'd balance things _slightly_ if immortals dropped 2 magic levels for a real death. Wouldn't help much - actually it'd just make certain that no one ever took their pretender near hostile domain.

Originally posted by sergex:
I also agree that lots of pretenders are underpowered and thus not used in competitive play. I think if all pretenders were given recuperation then Immortality won't be as overpowered as it is now. Other than that, a total overhaul and rebalancing of costs and powers with MP in mind and not costing them in terms of roleplaying flavor would be helpful. The only problem is that the devs don't have much experience in MP it seems so it would be nice if they would host their own polls and discussions to arrive at a conclusion.

I really don't think they should leave it up to modders to balance pretenders.

They haven't left balance up to the Modders, the Modders can 'balance' whatever they'd like and their Version of balance (whatever that may be) is achieved. Modding is a privilage so you can play the game how you envisioned it, not a tool for balance.

While the Dev's may not play 'hardcore' MP they do play MP because that is how the game is designed, though it is more aligned with Roleplay than efficency or 'fairness'.

[ May 03, 2004, 04:14: Message edited by: Zen ]

[PvK]

Many of the human pretenders have 10-point path costs. Since they also cost significantly fewer points, that is already like giving them the option of being rainbow pretenders.

I haven't heard anything convincing yet that the immortals or non-humans are better than their point costs. For supercombatant pretenders, well, it would be unnatural if it were otherwise.

PvK

[Norfleet]

Originally posted by PvK:
Many of the human pretenders have 10-point path costs. Since they also cost significantly fewer points, that is already like giving them the option of being rainbow pretenders.

I wouldn't say they cost SIGNIFICANTLY fewer points by any stretch. A typical human pretender chassis runs for perhaps 30-50 points....which is not all that much smaller than, say, a Nataraja or a Dragon.

[PDF]

Originally posted by PvK:
Many of the human pretenders have 10-point path costs. Since they also cost significantly fewer points, that is already like giving them the option of being rainbow pretenders.

I haven't heard anything convincing yet that the immortals or non-humans are better than their point costs. For supercombatant pretenders, well, it would be unnatural if it were otherwise.

PvK

That ain't true : a RB with weak dominion cost nearly AS MUCH as a magic-competent SC chassis or Bless-effect path-9 pretender. He is significantly weaker though...
Example :
Druid F2 A2 E2 S3 D2 N2, dom 4, 10 hp, puny stats, that guy gets "bonus" Vine stuff : 260 points !

Son of Niefel W4 any-4 dom 5, 90 hp, str 28 etc... This one gets a free Winter Wolf each turn, without even using the turn to do so : 240 points !!!!
Moloch Fire-9 dom 5, 55 hp, Fear, Flying, Fire resistant : 264 points !!

Where's the problem ? I didn't even compare to a VQ or GK

[Leif_-]

Perhaps the human pretenders could get the benefit of their own bless effect? It would be a nice little perk, without being particularly unbalancing, and it would also be in theme with them being highly skilled magicians.