Dominion Vs Military

[Arryn]

Cainehill said:
Ouch. So, all the temples I built in back provinces in several games are useless, except for raising the max dominion push of the pretender and prophet?

If what Nagot says is true (and I see no reason to doubt his veracity), then Ceremony's doc is in serious need of amending, and those of us who've relied upon it for the conduct of our campaigns may have wasted a great deal of time and wealth. Contrary to the doc, if a province's dominion "fills up", it will continue to spill over into successive provinces ad infinitum, in an expanding ripple, without the need for a "temple check" in that, or a directly-adjacent, province. This is the best way to explain dominion spread as Nagot is asserting. The only other way, that of the game checking for dominion push from a source out to *all* provinces, for each and every check, makes even less sense and would eat up enormous amounts of CPU time.

[deccan]

Maybe dominion generated by temples is handled differently than that generated by pretenders / prophets. Unlikely, but possible.

I can attest that in SP games on large maps my dominion can go a long, long way until it "hits" a wall of black candles and then stops.

[Arralen]

xxxxxx deleted wrong info - sorry, folks xxxxxxxxxxxx


Personally, I have seen dom "wander" FOUR indie provinces from my starting location (no pretenders/prophet ever walked into that direction) in the game (SP) I'm just playing.

[Agrajag]

Just wanted to report a bit on my findings in a 1on1 game I had against the AI
My dominion score (in the making of the pretender) was very low, I'd say around 1-3.
I lost due to no dominion when my furthest province from his nearest province was ATLEAST 5 provinces away.
Just thought you should know.

[Cohen]

The assumption that your domain spread to max 2 provinces away from the source is absolutely false.

How to see this?
Create a God with 10 Dominion, create a game with this god and another human god.
Make him hosting (without playing) for a lot of turns, and then check. So you'll see how the dominion with spread with capitol and god only, without moving them
I got 50 turns, and the domain was in provinces far away from my capitol. (5 provinces away it reached for now)

[deccan]

Even so and even in SP, pushing dominion can be important. As mentioned, the AI does tend to spam temples. In my current game, I didn't let that bother me, and I had negative dominion 2 or 3 provinces deep inside my territory. Then he cast "Dark Skies", and all of a sudden my troops has like morale or 7 and 8. Ouch.

[Boron]

Cohen said:
The assumption that your domain spread to max 2 provinces away from the source is absolutely false.

How to see this?
Create a God with 10 Dominion, create a game with this god and another human god.
Make him hosting (without playing) for a lot of turns, and then check. So you'll see how the dominion with spread with capitol and god only, without moving them
I got 50 turns, and the domain was in provinces far away from my capitol. (5 provinces away it reached for now)

yep very true . i tested it myself now too . probably the temple spreads work the same way too .
so far i too believed as Arryn the 2 province rule from the mentioned dominionguide.pdf .
hm this leads to new interesting possibilities :

only build as much temples until you reach dominionstrengh of 10 ( so 10 when you start with dominion 8 etc. ) .

furthermore i think when you have maximum dominion in a province the dominionspread check always wanders further to provinces with not maximum dominion strenghts .

so in theory playing as mictlan there should be no big difference when playing with max dominion when spreading dominion via 5 blood sacrifices near your capitol temples or in temples near the front .
only the center of maximum dominionstrengh should vary but total dominion strengh should be the same with both methods or ?


in general you can put up the rule then i think :
build as many temples as you need to reach dominionstrength of 10 and all additional temples are only optional when you can afford but not neccessary .

[Lex]

why does it say you can't preach in a province because its reached maximum dominion, but then you look and there's only 2-3 dominion on that province, and your Pretender's dominion is like 8. what gives? do provinces have a maximum dominion different then your Pretender depending on circumstance?

[Cohen]

Simply there's no limit where your domain could spread.

Every Dominion Point you get, plus the bonus of the temples (+1 every 5 temples, to a max of 10) gives you the chance that a temple, prophet and god (god counts as 1 dominion point fixed and 2 temple check) add 1 point of dominion.
Having dominion 5 means your temples have a 50% chance of pumping your domain by 1.

The temple try to raise first the dominion where it's located, but it's not sure. The closer the dominion is to his maximum, the more are the chances the temple spread the dominion point in another province starting with the neighbouring.

When all provinces are maxed of dominion, every temple pumping dominion will push your dominion in the enemy border.

Every slave sacrificed count as a temple check.

So on the more temple you've the better it is.

And dominion is usually needed for many strategies, most of them already said, but I resume them.
First you need it to support your pretender and prophet if they're going to operate in enemy territory, so you need dominion push.
Second, immortals. There're a lot of them, Wraithlords, Vampires, and such, they benefit of immortality only under your domain.
Third, your troops get a morale bonus.
Fourth, you get your scales, instead of the enemy ones, and enemy dominion bring unrest.
Fifth, some nation dominion is fearful, like SG or AE Ermor, or CW Pan (they kill your pop), or C'tis Miasma (it disease your non swamp survival troops).
Sixth, many spells work only under your domain.
Seventh, if you've heat or cold scale it benefits your troops, and can weaken enemy troops (like Jotun Niefel Jarls have -2 att and def in heat scale).
Last you can kill people by out dominion them!!!

Probably I'm forgetting something, but it seems a good list to make your domain very important.

[Vynd]

Lex said:
why does it say you can't preach in a province because its reached maximum dominion, but then you look and there's only 2-3 dominion on that province, and your Pretender's dominion is like 8. what gives? do provinces have a maximum dominion different then your Pretender depending on circumstance?

A Priest can only raise dominion in a province up to his level in holy magic. So a basic indy priest can preach a province up to a positive 2 dominion, but no higher. This is what the message you're seeing refers to, not the max dominion that your nation is capable of. You pretty much have to rely on your Pretender, Prophet, and temples to truly max out your dominion in a province.