Devil Review

[Gandalf Parker]

incognito said:
Huzur - you mention Arch & Ice as important summons. What about Helio's? Any good on a relative basis or stick with vamps? Also what about the demon lords? A lot of blood slaves to be sure, but the stats look effectives.

Also, what are good equipment combos for the arch/ice? Do you equip all the same or is there a plan for variety & counters to certain anti-SC strategies?

Thanks for the great tips. Not sure I'll survive long enough to get these guys en masse (Van has launched an attack already), but it's sure nice knowing.

One of the things I love to do with demons is make assassins out of them if they can sneak (black heart). Especially if they can do bind-heart. Especially if they can summon other sneaks. Especially if they can fly. MUHAHahahahaha.

I think a bind-heart assassin is an ultimate strategy (please lets not start a thread to get it "fixed"). If they are coming at you with an army of say 5 commanders leading 50 troops each. You sneak in your assassin and have him strike. Their commander becomes your commander with all his equipment, and he is down one commander. The next message says there is a combat in that province as your new convert is visible and gets attacked by his old buddies. 50 troops rout for lack of a commander and some damage is done to his army. Your assassin is hidden and does not participate. Now your assassin strikes again. Another commander switches sides. Maybe the other guy moves his army but it still leaves 50 troops behind waiting for a new commander to lead them. You follow him and snatch commanders one by one chopping his army into bits scattered across the map or routed to nothingness. The Last commander is the most fun. He attacks his previous troops. One guy against 50 troops but they all rout for lack of leadership and you now own that province.

[Soapyfrog]

Gandalf Parker said:
I think a bind-heart assassin is an ultimate strategy

I am not sure it is "ultimate" since it is both counterable and has a chance of failure, but it is fun and it will give your oppoenents headaches, thats for sure!

[Gandalf Parker]

Soapyfrog said:

I am not sure it is "ultimate" since it is both counterable and has a chance of failure, but it is fun and it will give your oppoenents headaches, thats for sure!

True. But there is also my favorite "step up".
A Garnet Amazon (red) province with a lab, 0 taxes, and no Province Defense. Send a lvl 5 air mage (or lvl 3 air mage with a Bag of Wind and that Winged Helm). Build amazon mages and set them to hunting blood slaves.

Have all the mages set to hellbind, hellbind, hellbind, attack. Have the air mage cast Wind Ride every turn against some province in your enemys territory. Its like a birthday present each turn. You want to rush to that province to see what you got and what items it had on it. The real prize is ending up having 2 or 3 prophets all working in your name.

[Stormbinder]

Gandalf Parker said:

True. But there is also my favorite "step up".
A Garnet Amazon (red) province with a lab, 0 taxes, and no Province Defense. Send a lvl 5 air mage (or lvl 3 air mage with a Bag of Wind and that Winged Helm). Build amazon mages and set them to hunting blood slaves.

Have all the mages set to hellbind, hellbind, hellbind, attack. Have the air mage cast Wind Ride every turn against some province in your enemys territory. Its like a birthday present each turn. You want to rush to that province to see what you got and what items it had on it. The real prize is ending up having 2 or 3 prophets all working in your name.

That's nice setup Gandelf and I agree, it is certanly fun. But I think it can only work once in MP if you are playing against good opponent, since the next turn you will likely to get a Ghost Riders/other magical-summon/teleport attack on your "Christmas present" province. If it has just bunch of amazons set on "hellbind" and air 5 mage, as your described, it'll not stop this attack, and your mages will be killed/routed. If your opponent would also block all retreat routes than all your mages will be lost.

[Cainehill]

Managed to Wind Ride / Charm about a half dozen commanders in an ongoing game - I also had enough other troops to slow down or kill tough opponents, and could probably have held off ghost riders, possibly even two.

[Gandalf Parker]

Stormbinder said:
That's nice setup Gandelf and I agree, it is certanly fun. But I think it can only work once in MP if you are playing against good opponent, since the next turn you will likely to get a Ghost Riders/other magical-summon/teleport attack on your "Christmas present" province. If it has just bunch of amazons set on "hellbind" and air 5 mage, as your described, it'll not stop this attack, and your mages will be killed/routed. If your opponent would also block all retreat routes than all your mages will be lost.

I admit that I dont remember being at the other end of windride. I suppose it does say where the commander went.

Having troops or defence there tended to kill the sucker before I could convert him so I knew I was taking chances with no troops and no defence. I usually had my windmage set for a couple of actions and then retreat or some sort of safety transport. It was the only piece of importance. Taking back the province is no big deal.

It might not be an ultimate strategy but its a fun one to keep in the carddeck just in case you get the chance to use it.

[Stormbinder]

Gandalf Parker said:

I admit that I dont remember being at the other end of windride. I suppose it does say where the commander went.

Having troops or defence there tended to kill the sucker before I could convert him so I knew I was taking chances with no troops and no defence. I usually had my windmage set for a couple of actions and then retreat or some sort of safety transport. It was the only piece of importance. Taking back the province is no big deal.

It might not be an ultimate strategy but its a fun one to keep in the carddeck just in case you get the chance to use it.

Oh, it is certanly fun, I agree. I never tried to set up such "presents" factory on the regular basis that you have described. It would be interesting to try in on of my MP games, just for the heck of it.

[Tuidjy]

I do not think it is the ghost rider type spells that are the real
problem. In a game with Cohen, I was running a variation of this:
the firing squad province. I had about ten sages, an arch seraph,
and a few defenders. The 'wind ridden' commanders were tried,
found guilty and executed in a very efficient manner. I was pestering
him for a few turns, snatching his merc commanders on the turn he
renewed their contracts, splitting his devil armies in two, etc...
He did attempt a few attacks on the provinces, but the sages held
their own (frozen heart and false horror are quite unpleasant)

I was sure that I would soon be at the receiving end of some seeking
arrows or flames from sky, and that would be the end of the joy rides,
given that I would have had to dome the province, or lose expensive
commanders. Fortunately, I happened to snatch his pretender and then
the commander of his Last devil squad... and he quit on turn 22.

But the point of all this was that if you have a province like this,
you will probably be arrowed or flamed.

[Cainehill]

Gandalf Parker said:
I think a bind-heart assassin is an ultimate strategy ...
You follow [enemy armies] and snatch commanders one by one chopping his army into

Problem is that you have to snatch a commander; move the next turn, guessing which way the enemy is going; if lucky, snatch a commander, else guess which way the enemy is going and try again.

Does Bind-Heart leave the target as a commander, or does it steal the willpower? I haven't played enough blood to know, but I find that Nature's Charm is somewhat superior to the Astral Version for that reason. In which case, one of Pangaea's big stealthy mages with flying boots and the black heart might be even more effective than the demon, since you get (for instance) fully equipped banelords and such on your side.

[Gandalf Parker]

Cainehill said:
Does Bind-Heart leave the target as a commander, or does it steal the willpower? I haven't played enough blood to know, but I find that Nature's Charm is somewhat superior to the Astral Version for that reason. In which case, one of Pangaea's big stealthy mages with flying boots and the black heart might be even more effective than the demon, since you get (for instance) fully equipped banelords and such on your side.

Bind Heart does leave him as a commander. And seems to work more often than some of the others. Pangaea has stealthy gods which make for a fun assassin. Pandemoniacs make good bind-heart assassins also.

Another advantage with Pangaea for assassins is that even without a charm they speed up taking provinces ALOT! A Pan assassin tosses Maenads each turn. So you assassinate a commander then there is an attack by 3 or 4 loose maenads. It makes it easy to know when you get the Last commander, and the province is yours automatically without having to take another turn to do an attack.