What's the best way to use non native gems ?

[Yossar]

What kind of gem income are we talking about? I rarely get that many gems of a type I don't have mages for, but I also don't use my pretender to search much. If you don't have the mages to use the gems, you don't have the mages to use the gems, but there are a few items that can help you get there. Ring of sorcery/wizardry and staff of elemental mastery help you get points in magic types that you are weak in. Then it's easy to blow through those gems. At worst you can trade the gems with someone who needs them more than you do (unless we're talking about single player).

[Arryn]

Boron left out Wind Ride as a major use for air gems. Another excellent use for Nature gems is to crank out Ivy Kings which in turn can crank out hordes of upkeep-free Vine Ogres. Fairy Queens are another good use for Nature. Flames from the Sky alone justify fire gems, but another great use is to create Sceptres of Authority in the mid game and Rods of the Phoenix later on. And you can always alchemize them for gold or other gems. Fire gems have more uses than Boron may think. And I don't understand how Boron can mention all the handy items that require Astral, plus Acashic record, and various globals, nevermind Wish and then not include Astral in his list of "most important" gems. Boron, though, is absolutely correct in saying that you can never have enough gems.

[deccan]

Astrals are also always good for dispelling globals...

[Endoperez]

Boosters. If you go for a rainbow, check out the boosters.


Maximum skill level national mages of Machaka (FFEED? and FDNN?) can achieve with boosters they and FWWAASS pretender can forge if boosters are used to make more items...

2F? +3 Fire = 6F
? +3 Air= 4A (5A with pretender)
? +3 Water = 4W (5W with pretender)
2E? +2 Earth = 5E
? +2 Astral= 3S (4S with pretender)
2N?+3 Nature= 6N
D?+2 Death=4D
? + 0 Blood = 1

They can summon Mound Fiend (they have 3D, right?) which can further summon Wraith Lords and Demiliches, so they can also get powerful mages of Death.

This is without counting in unique items or Rings of Sorcery/Wizardry, which help a lot. There is an excel file that lists all the boosters, you might want to hunt that down if you are interested...


EDIT: Forgot 2Air from the pretender...

[Vynd]

I'm all for using the gems to summon casters that can use them, if your own mages cannot. But let's not forget alchemy! If you can't use your Fire gems, turn them into gold, or into even more gems that you can use.

[Boron]

Arryn said:
And I don't understand how Boron can mention all the handy items that require Astral, plus Acashic record, and various globals, nevermind Wish and then not include Astral in his list of "most important" gems.

I didn't list them because once you start clamming you should have no astral shortage anymore . At least astrals should be your biggest or second biggest ( after blood ) gem income then .

If you play a game with houserule no clams or 10 clams or similiar then astral gems become one of the most important gems too imo

But as long as you have water + death at least from midgame on you can cope the astral shortage with every nation by starting to forge clams with spectres .


Imo the biggest shortage i always have in :
1. Deathgems
2. Watergems
3. Earthgems

[Nagot Gick Fel]

Boron said:
If you play a game with houserule no clams or 10 clams or similiar then astral gems become one of the most important gems too imo

I'll never understand your logic. If you forge clams like mad when you're allowed to do so, it's obviously because astral gems are _very_ important to you, and water much less so.

[Cainehill]

I think it's great to find sources of gems that your nation isn't strong in. They taste great, and can be used to make great hot sauces.

It is somewhat frustrating to get huge incomes of some gem type that dwarfs what your nation is _supposed_ to have. Water nations that can't find any water, Astral nations who can't find astral, etc - those are the two which have the best chance of finding "alien" gem income, what with Voice of Tiamat and Akashic Record.

Still - path boosters and/or empowerment, or summonings, can really let you take advantage of those gems (especially via Spectres, Lamia Queens, and Couatls).

And, they do make great hot sauce. Nothing like a little Nature in your Picante Verde, and Astral gives a very nice citrus sparkle to the flavors even if it doesn't have the habanero heat of Fire or Death.

[Boron]

Nagot Gick Fel said:

I'll never understand your logic. If you forge clams like mad when you're allowed to do so, it's obviously because astral gems are _very_ important to you, and water much less so.

But since clams are forged from water gems to start the hoarding water is more valuable then astral .
Astral itself is not so valuable for me cause i normally convert my huge clam astral income in water for further gems and either wish for blood or convert it to death mostly .

So water is more valuable then astral cause it is the input while astral is only the output .

[Nagot Gick Fel]

Boron said:
But since clams are forged from water gems to start the hoarding water is more valuable then astral .

No. That's equivalent to say "when I alchemize X to Y, X is more valuable to me than Y". Or "when I convert raw materials to cars, the materials are more valuable than the cars". You NEED materials to make cars, but it's the cars that are IMPORTANT to you.

So water is more valuable then astral cause it is the input while astral is only the output .

When input is more important than output, it's a sure sign the conVersion is inneficient. Err, never mind, just send me ten dollars and I'll teach how to earn five!