OT (or is it?): American Imperialism

[dogscoff]

And even then, I'm pretty sure that's just a European practice taken to the utmost extreme.

Thankyou, that actually sums up my attitudes to American culture better than my own last post did. It seems that American culture is all about pushing evrything to its furthest possible extreme. Cars are good. Therefore, it must be good for everyone to have two cars each, and for each one to be the size and weight of an armoured personnel carrier. You like burgers? Well, here's a burger the size of your head- buy one get another free. Guys like boobs, right? Well then girls, go out and get surgery so your tits look like a couple of badly parked Volkswagen Beetles.

Moderation is gradually being erased, replaced by a culture of excession. This is a bad thing, in terms of personal health, public life and global resources. What's more, it's extremely hard to resist this kind of excession because it is so... well... excessive. By definition it has to be bigger, heavier, louder and richer and will out-compete and utterly destroy (or at least absorb, bastardise, soil, repackage and sell on) any more moderate alternative that stands in its way. It's a plague, it's the Borg. This is what the usa has brought to global culturem and this is why there is now this backlash (moderate backlash, like mine, and extreme backlash, like Al-Qaeda) against US culture.

[narf poit chez BOOM]

Moderation in all things are some pretty good words to live by.

However, if someone sells you something and you buy it, you are responcible for the use to which you put it.

[dogscoff]

Then go complain to the people that purchased them and quit blaming America for an "arm-twisting" that didn't occur. In order for something to sell, there needs to be a market. (I shake my head everytime I see one, too!)

Ah yes, market forces. The sacred democracy of the wallet. Unfortunately, it's all hogsh!t. A company with enough money can generate any demand it wants out of thin air- it's called marketing. I mean seriously, what possible reason could there be for anyone (anyone not planning to invade something, anyway) to actually want a Humvee other than for image? It serves no other purpose that couldn't be served cheaper, cleaner and more efficiently by a smaller vehicle. It's a false demand, resulting from the culture of excession in my previous post.

[Ragnarok-X]

Slightly OT, but did someone watch "SuperSize ME" ? I think it pretty much fits the topic. In my opinion the USA are trying to force their way of life onto everyone else, weiter it be by force or without. Just recently i read that america has deposit 180 !!! nuclear weapons over military bases in germany, france, spain and great brittain. The reason for this is because in a condition of war, those missiles can reach targets in europe faster than when launched from north-america. Just imagine this...now, about their various wars against islamic countries...now that korea announced they have nuclear weapons, how will bush react to this ? Didnt he promised he would make america "safe" and keep the people "safe" ? All i can is that both bush, the administration and EVERYONE who voted for bush in the last election of a stupid **** and should care for this children or whatever may come after him.

A lot of people will agree with me, weither they openly say so or dont.

[geoschmo]

It's not a plague Dogscoff. I might be convinced that it's an addiction, but it's not a disease. It's not the Borg. People sucumbing to rampant consumerism aren't losing their free will. They aren't being made to do anything they don't want to do. I won't argue it's not healthy, but I won't try and complain that it's McDonalds fault I'm so overweight either. I've eaten a lot of cheeseburgers in my life time. And I can honestly say that in every case the hand stuffing it in my face was attached to my own arm.

Where is your nations responsibility in this discussion? Why are you here protesting the evils of American greed and our prosteltyzing form of consumer excess, instead of preaching to your own countrymen for taking part in the very activities which are the real cause of you afflictions. Supply follows demand D, not the other way around.

It's nothing person though D. I'll be the first to admit that Americans are just as bad at this sort of attitude of victimization. We meddle in Latin American political affairs telling ourselves we are trying to stop the flow of drugs into our country when the flow would stop if we simply stopped snorting the drugs in the first place. And of course, the whole Middle East would be nothing to us but a bunch of sand if we didn't need the oil to satisfy our own excesive desires.

But really, how would you take it if we started complaining that the reason we drive SUV's is because the Arab countries keep supplying us with so much cheap gasoline? The argument doesn't really work does it?

[Jack Simth]

TerranC said:

Mr. Dutchman, read what you have typed there once more, very carefully, word per word, and see if it makes sense.

StrategiaInUltima said:
If it doesn't make sense, well heck. As long as my point gets across I don't matter if I'm writing something in English, then encrypt it using an alphanumeric key, translate what I've got into Chinese, encrypt that using another alphanumeric key, translate it into Indonesian and then back into English.

I suspect it wasn't the language itself he was referring to, so much as the appearence of a double-standard in the post; in a thread you started about diliking America supposedly forcing it's ways on the rest of the world, mostly through big buisiness, you blithly mention an incidence of Europe forcing it's views on the rest of the world, mostly be military force.

That, and the little matter of assuming the country had exactly the same religion as it's rulers, then switched after they threw them out.

[dogscoff]

Geo, I'm not trying to take away free will. People do have the power to make their own choices about what they want, but most of the time they don't bother. And of course capitalism is only too happy to capitalise on this all-too-human laziness and desire to conform and tell people what they want. You want a humvee. You want macdonalds. You want to pay £200 for a pair of shoes that cost $2 to make. You want to pay Malboro to give you cancer.

It's all screwed up.

Finally, I would be more than happy to discuss this with my countrymen if met anyone who would actually listen. I discuss it here not because there are lots of americans here to ***** at, but because there are intelligent people here who I can have a discussion with.

[Strategia_In_Ultima]

Ragnarok... it's indeed bull****. The US could also simply place those missiles on nuclear subs RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF THE GULF. They have plenty of nuke subs, so why the [censored] do they need to place ONE HUNDRED AND FRICKING EIGHTY NUKES in Europe? Are they afraid of the possible emerging of the Soviet State of France and Western Europe or something? They have NO REASON - NO REASON AT ALL - to place those nukes on OUR soil. And what if something goes wrong? Who's to blame? I can imagine the US (toto pro pars for Bush):
"The recent nuclear accident was probably the result of either a terrorist attack or negligence on the part of the Europeans that looked after the nukes. For now, we assume that US citizens were not in any way responsible for the accident, other than that they should have kept better watch over the weapons."
And I really think that son of a mother****ing ***** would actually say something like above... and I don't think Europeans are even ALLOWED NEAR those nukes. Almost NOBODY knew about the EIGHTY nukes in my country until someone published an article about it - and immediately one of my country's left-wing parties (the one I support) began openly demanding those nukes to be transferred out of Holland in parliament. Greece has already voted to remove the nukes stationed there, but it is not clear whether or not they HAVE actually been removed.

[Slynky]

Sorry if I come off upset when I hear that people of their own free will purchase stupid items (whether it be American or not). Before we got "international" with this kind of finger-pointing at "evil" America, I got just as upset when I heard (yet another) complaint from the black communities that tobacco and alcohol manufacturers target them--as if humans didn't posses a free will to refuse to buy things simply because they saw a picture of it.

So, to ANYONE, of ANY nationality who uses their money to buy something that's either stupid, over-priced, or bad for them, go look in the mirror and quit blaming others. People need to take responsibility for their choices. I used to smoke. If I get cancer later, it's my fault. I used to eat fast food / McDonalds. If I never return to a healthy state again, it's my fault.

I just get a little tired of everyone lumping in all their unhappiness about their lives into a big rotten tomato to throw at America.

[Strategia_In_Ultima]

I'm not just throwing rotten tomatoes at America. And I won't say something bull****ty like "Oh no, I'm also throwing their rotten nukes back to them as well" but I'm serious. I also believe that people should make their own choices (as I'm existentialist - i.e. the choices I make for myself I indirectly make for the rest of humanity too) but I'm saying that America is always actively influencing our choices - marketing, commercials, American "vanity projects" like the invasion of Iraq, etc.