Stellar Manipulation Suggestion for 1.42

[CW]

quote:

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I second the motion to have a 'gravity well' device or somesuch that prevents wormholes from entering a specific system (and a device that does not take 20+ turns to build!!!!)

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I'd rather not see that happen! It will make WP openers totally worthless! Better take the second option suggested with a bit of amendment - make the newly created warp points unstable for a few turns, let them be VERY unstable to start with then gradually stabilise out. A very desperate opponent can take the chance and risk his fleet wiped out by sending it straight through a newly created warp point, on the other hand you can play it safe by giving up your element of surprise - the longer you wait the less chance/degree of damage.

[Deathstalker]

Quote"quote:
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I second the motion to have a 'gravity well' device or somesuch that prevents wormholes from entering a specific system (and a device that does not take 20+ turns to build!!!!)
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I'd rather not see that happen! It will make WP openers totally worthless!
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Simple to fix, just have a new Intelligence project added to destroy the 'gravity well' or whatever is keeping the wormhole from opening. Or find out from an 'ally' which planet the device is on and send a cloaked stealth ship to bomb it. The point I was trying to make is that there should be a 'counter' for every action. (or maybe the device should slow the wormhole opening, make it take 2 turns or something, give you warning....Or heck, how about just giving Stellar Tech wormhole devices different levels (I, II, III etc) and needing an 'upgraded' device to defend vs. each level (need device II to defend against a wormhole opener I or II but III still works))

Just some more food for thought......

[capnq]

quote:

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Simple to fix, just have a new Intelligence project added to destroy the 'gravity well' or whatever is keeping the wormhole from opening.

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Does that need a new project? I'd think there's already a facility destroying project in there some where. (I don't know for sure, because I've only ever researched past Intel 2 twice so far.)

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Cap'n Q

The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the
human mind to correlate all of its contents. We live on a placid
island of ignorance in the midst of black seas of infinity, and it was
not meant that we should go far. -- HP Lovecraft, "The Call of Cthulhu"

[Rollo]

I disagree that Stellar Manipulation (WPO, Warp point opening) should be altered in any way.
SE IV prior to WPO could be compared to World War I. It is essentially a trench war. Everybody tries to defend choke points as good as possible. Sometimes the enemy gets through, sometimes not. You can always fall back or have additional lines of defense.
When WPO comes into play that all changes. Static defenses are useless, mobility is the key (WW II, tanks, Blitzkrieg). What's so bad about it? It's a great thing to break stalemates and deal out some serious (if not lethal) damage to your enemy. You have to adjust to that and make use of it, instead of thinking how to change it.

quote:

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originally posted by Magus38:
This has bothered me for some time actually, I am surprised that it has not been as issue before as it is so obviously destructive to strategy. All you can do in such a situation is react.

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If you find this so destructive to strategy, why don't you make it part of your strategy and disrupt your opponents plans?

Honestly, if can grow a healthy empire and wage war against your enemy with "conventional methods", while diverting some resources to develop and build WPO (not to mention another fleet to send through) then you have done well and deserve to win. Just don't put too much into stellar manipulation or your enemy will crush you before you ever opened one warp point . IMHO, this is one of the great aspects of the game. No need to change it. There doesn't have to be a counter measure (gravity well device) for everything in the game, let alone a counter measure against the counter measure (Intel project to destroy gravity device).

If both sides have the ability to do this and send a hundred base ships through. Well great, than we have nuclear war. No defenses, no survivors, mutual destruction assured, the end of all (Maybe, it's time to make peace and talk arms reduction? ).

Just my opinion,
Rollo

[Magus38]

quote:

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Originally posted by Rollo:
What's so bad about it? It's a great thing to break stalemates and deal out some serious (if not lethal) damage to your enemy. You have to adjust to that and make use of it, instead of thinking how to change it.

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Why make the assumption from what I wrote that I like stalemates or entrenched positions? I am not arguing for the elimination of WP technology. The solution I would prefer is that of temporary instability. A good suggestion was offered a couple of Posts ago. It offered the idea that the WP move from very unstable to stable across a short series of turns, so that you could pass through it the turn of its' creation, but would incur serious risks to your fleet in doing so.

In any case, please understand my purpose. I like WP technology and I agree that it could move the game into another phase of warfare requiring greater reaction speed, better planning, etc. There is nothing "wrong with that", in fact there is everything right with that, again in theory. The problem, with the technology as it is currently implemented, is that I can show up with a fleet and glass and entire system relatively easily (I know having done it) and my opponent can do nothing but react after the fact. I'll go one step further... I can show up, glass an entire system and then leave, closing the new wormwhole after me. I am sorry but, as it stands now, how skilled a strategist you are becomes completely IRRELEVANT. No amount of adjustment in my thinking is going to alter that outcome because there simply is no way to prepare for this.

Where no preparation is possible, no strategy is possible.


[This message has been edited by Magus38 (edited 06 September 2001).]

[This message has been edited by Magus38 (edited 06 September 2001).]

[CyC]

The strategy is the blizt blizt situation

Techniques of protecting yourself against WormHoles
1. get WormHole tech first and use it on them.
2. Use diplomatic threats and negotiations if multiple empires have Worm Hole tech get a truce saying that if an empire uses a Blitz tactic everyone else will Blitz them.
3. Keep multiple blitz stations yourself and keep them on the move, If someone tries to blitz you, You Blitz them back both where they come in and esecially where they came from since they would of sent most there defence to blitz you.
4. In ultra important system (You should never have ultra important systems) place mines and storms in every sector around the edges of your systems in the directions of your enemies.(Worm holes always apear around the edges of your system)
5. Massive amount of fighter and Planetary Bases in every system (this is really a Last resort and never works).
6. Keep all your ships togeather and moving and keep a Worm Hole creation ship (biggest posible) with your vessels at all times so you can be anywhere in a moments notice. Never Put a few ships at each planet ships are valuable yet useless by them selves.



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CyC
L+++ GdY $!+ Fr+ C--- S* T!- Sf++ Tcp++ A? M++ MpM RV Pw+ Fq++ Nd+++++ Rp++ G

[DirectorTsaarx]

quote:

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Originally posted by CyC:
<snip>
4. In ultra important system (You should never have ultra important systems) place mines and storms in every sector around the edges of your systems in the directions of your enemies.(Worm holes always apear around the edges of your system)
<snip>

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Actually, if you turn on the option "warp points can appear anywhere in system" at game setup, the player-created warp points also appear anywhere, not just on the edges.

So you'd be better off putting minefields on your planets. Besides, you could concentrate your forces better that way; spreading mines all around the edge of a system is a tad drastic.

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L++ GdY $ Fr>Fr++ C++ SdS T-- Sf Tcp? A%% M- Mp! RTH!P Pw Fq-->Fq+ Nd>Nd+++++ Rp++ G+