Yet Another Dominions Game - Game Running!

[Jurri]

End of the world as you know it, perhaps!

Hey Izaq, if you want, I can start saving up my turn files in case you want to see the dark side of the force, too. Not that they are especially brilliant, even if my long-term strategy has proven rather successful.

I can't believe I got had - again - the same way Ygorl took me with his hit squads. Like, I prepared for it for ~10 consequtive turns by sneaking a turn after a turn spent fighting, but since nothing happened I quit: bam!, exactly then it happened again.

[WraithLord]

Jurri said:
End of the world as you know it, perhaps!

Hey Izaq, if you want, I can start saving up my turn files in case you want to see the dark side of the force, too. Not that they are especially brilliant, even if my long-term strategy has proven rather successful.

I can't believe I got had - again - the same way Ygorl took me with his hit squads. Like, I prepared for it for ~10 consequtive turns by sneaking a turn after a turn spent fighting, but since nothing happened I quit: bam!, exactly then it happened again.

Bah, I only did it for fun, since with utterdark you're clearly winning.
I can do little to stop you.
In fact I am starting to consider switching to AI as it seems to me hopeless to fight your evil undead hordes...
If it's ok with the rest of you guys that is.

Hey, It would have been very nice to see your turns. I should have come with that idea earlier.

[Ygorl]

Well, Izaqyos, you and maybe Jotunheim are the non-Ermor powers right now. I'm somewhat curious to see what the new Jotun armies can do, but if you bite it then it's really only the giants versus the undead.
I could be a moderate pain in the butt for anyone who wants my capital but otherwise I am out of the running. I'm content either way; I'll be truly out of it come next Monday.
Y'all speak amongst yourselves and let me know what you want to do.
Anyway, I'll be excited to get into a new game when I return. Each nation I try teaches me so many new things... I feel like, maybe in a few years when I run out and have to start repeating, I'll be well prepared to kick some butt!

[Jurri]

Oh, I'm quite confident that if Izaq is spent I've pretty much won. The giants can't compete in research nor gems, and without Pythium there's no one left to dispell the evil globals. Also, with my income (46 death gems a turn, +a lot of astral) the globals come right back up again, even if the unlikely happens. I'm happy to be proven wrong, of course, if you want!

In the Faerun game I made an observation that if Ermor gets big enough it should win based solely on momentum. It's dang tiring to try and take Ermor's castles since they are worth very little to everyone else, especially with low magic sites, and very hard to take; I'm sure Izaq noticed that my endless hordes could tear down the walls much quicker than any army he fielded. Specifically since even though mindless units defend castles at 1/8 efficiency, they will still contribute a great deal if there's a sufficient number available.

Also, with Ermor one can just play the odds: I'm sure I've lost battles at about a rate of 4:1 or something, but the few victories are much more relevant than the losses. No real tactics necessary: just lob the undead at the enemy and hope that he doesn't have too much defense available.

I'll comment some more with better time; what says the good doctor about continuing? If you guys want to test things out I'll be happy to provide the testbed

[WraithLord]

I'll switch to AI this evening, but I agree with Jurri that the giants stand no chance against Ermor.
This is why I feel I can give a bit of my side.

I agree with Jurri on his other observations as well.
I tried first a strategy of conquest agains him. It was very costly to my armies because of supply issues and my gains very negligeble. Ermor would just hide a few hundred undead behind the castle walls while my beseiging troops starved outside. In addition Ermor constantly projected 4-6 GRs per turn on my armies.
Then I started building supply items but the globals started taking their toll on my econ.

So I switched strategy. Let Ermor keep his useless (to me) lands. I will concentrate on dispelling his globals and assisanating his army leaders while building a hoard econ and aiming for wish.
But, because I didn't clam hoard untill the late game, I had little astral income. Possibly lower then Ermor's. Too little to keep up with him on the globals front.

The utterdark was the killer though. I was forging 1-2 clams per turn and had a growing income of astral (20 when I quit). If not for utterdark I would have reached an income of 30-35 astral in ten turns. meaning I could dispel at least one global per turn. And later get to wish...

The burden of time hurt my economy just a little. Not enough to cause my surrender.
Utterdark lasting a few turns was clearly devastating.
Ironically the utterdark came at the same turn I assassinated Ermor's pretender

Jurri, you are right about Ermor's momentum but it doesn't take anything away from your strategy.
Had you done things differently the outcome might have been different.
For example If you had confronted my armies in the open After Van turned AI. Instead you chose to hide in your castles and let attrition and your globals wear me down.
You used your death gems wisely.

All in all it was a very interesting game for me. Actually one of the best MP games. I learnt a lot and enjoyed every moment of it.
I've kept a fair amount of Pythium turns.
I can upload them if there's interest.
They show the story of the downfall of a great Pythium empire to the relentless undead hordes of Ermor.

[Jurri]

Izaqyos, your armies were very effective against the horde! Indeed, I didn't quite realize before just how huge a difference a rich world makes (the fool that I am). It's one of the very best ways to stop ghost riders and Ashen Empire, targeting the leaders. In fact, for a moment it seemed to me that I couldn't stop your advance at all, and would have to rely on Burden of Time and Utterdark, neither of which I had never tried before, and my stash of lictors. Luckily your hoburgs weren't the best there are for bringing down walls, while eating well enough their share What did you research, by the way? I expected Arcane Nexus or Wrath of God anytime now!

This was indeed a highly interesting game. I figured I'd get an advantage from no-diplomacy, since Ermor isn't usually confronted alone: When Man berserked me at the beginning I was proven wrong Luckily, a bunch of spectators can stop most any rush, especially since the siege will inevitably thin the ranks of the assailant.

Van had good tactics and took great advantage of the rich setting with his bless-strategy. In my opinion he was far too agressive, attacking both me and Pythium at the same time; indeed, had he attacked only one of us, things would have gone differently.

Atlantis had a good thing going for a long time. I had great trouble countering his raids with his insane priests and mind burning mages... Here, again, the castles saved me. As did ghost riders, later on.

My strategy from the beginning was to not attack anyone, as time is on Ermor's side. Wasn't very effective, as once I finished a war another started, without my initiative. Tell the truth, I'm not even sure why I won, as my tactics are hardly stellar and my strategy didn't work out as planned. It has to be an inherent unbalace in the nations or something; one could argue that Ermor is qualitatively better than the rest on a one-on-one basis, possessing unique strengths. All in all, a good game, thank you!

I guess it would be considerate to liberate the spot on Mosehansen before Ygorl vanishes (have a safe trip, man!), unless DocPraetorius objects. (When was he due back, again?)

[Ygorl]

I don't know that it would have made a big difference in the long run, but I was really hurt by one particular stale... I was trying to make it home from NY in time, but it just didn't happen... As a result of it, I lost seven Kings of the Deep, and also (maybe even more importantly) lost my front. From then on, I was chasing down packs of undead roaming around my interior, fragmenting my armies and not gaining ground, and it was the familiar story - my losses hurt me, Ermor's very rarely did.
Vanheim really did put on a strong showing. Twice I tried to start things, and twice I was beat down hard by a fireball-lobbing Moloch and a horde of glamorous elfkin.
Jurri and izaqyos demonstrated that even in a game with low gems and high research costs the research is hugely important. Some skillful maneuvering from both of you as well.
I've decided that I really like Atlantis's lineup of leaders. The big three are really all standout units. The only thing it's hurt by is the lack of an obvious mass-researcher (the WWWSS guys aren't too bad, but are capital only, and nobody's sacred so the bills get high; the W guys are more cost-effective, but they're so otherwise-useless and also capital-only that I couldn't bring myself to hire any. Maybe this was a mistake?) There aren't any sages underwater either.

[WraithLord]

seeing that things are settled I'd like to congrat Jurri for his victory. And all you other guys for a great game.

Manuk, You gave a hell of a show. Your bless strat. was optimal for this map settings and you maneuvered very well. I agree with Jurri that had you not attacked both Ermor and me you'd probably fare much better.

Ygorl, I watched Atlanis skirmish with Ermor. You played very well but I could see that Ermor is winning by attrition. one of the reasons I moved against Ermor asap, even before I finished Vanheim (AI). This turned out badly for me as Van's Moloch kept hurting me for a long time.

I didn't understand why Alneyan's Caelum lasted so little. I am used to Caelum being a top dog. Maybe he took the raptor's theme... Nor did I understand why Marignon turned AI. They had a good thing going and sure would have made a difference otherwise.

One odd thing though. I noticed that at no time I was at war with more then one nation. First I (together with Van) tore Tien chi apart. Then I had the longest war with Van and last a losing battle against the numerous undead.