War.... (Historical: 9/11 discussion thread)

BloodyRanger · #1 September 12th, 2001, 07:06 PM

Aside from trying to "hunt down" the perpetrators of this dispicable act, we should be asking ourselves "How do we prevent this in the future?" I am personally shocked that the airspace around the Pentagon is not more tightly regulated. If there weren't SAM sites around the Capital, there should be soon. Of course, being ordered to shoot down a plane full of US Citizens would be a trying experience to say the least.

geoschmo · #2 September 12th, 2001, 07:18 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Solar:
[BI have to say that I, too, am stunned that we didn't see this coming. If Tom Clancy, a novel writer, could predict an airliner being used as a terrorist weapon, why the hell is American Intelligence scratching their collective heads saying "Gee...I dunno. We never really thought about this kinda thing."[/b]

You are way off the mark here. Of course our intelligence operations thought about this sort of thing happening. But thinking about it and preventing it are too different things.

In the days and weeks to come we are going to hear tons of reports of information that someone should have been able to see this coming. Some of this will be rumor, but some of it will be true. But none of it changes the fact that it's very hard to infiltrate an organization such as this and discover their plans. And nearly inpossible to stop them once they have been put into motion.

How do you infiltrate an orginization who's members have dedicated their lives to. Not only that they are willing to die, but that their goal is to die in the performance of their mission?

And if you decide that's too hard, how do you stop an operation like this once it's started?

Strip searches at airports?
Armed guards on every airplane?
Fighter escorts for every airplane flying over populated areas, with orders to fire upon a fully loaded plane with innocent passengers if they deviate one iota from there prescribed flight plan?

We could move the airports 100 miles from any major city I guess.

The only way to stop things is to punish those responsible so that they they cannot do such things again.

If Bin Laden turns out to be responsible as most early indications point too, then the way we could have prevented this was to punish him for his terrorist activites over the Last 10+ years.

At the very least hounding him and pressuring other governments to not allow him sanctuary would have kept him on the run and unable to plan and execute this acts.

Geoschmo

Alpha Kodiak · #3 September 12th, 2001, 08:02 PM

quote:

Originally posted by geoschmo:
<snip>
The only way to stop things is to punish those responsible so that they they cannot do such things again.

If Bin Laden turns out to be responsible as most early indications point too, then the way we could have prevented this was to punish him for his terrorist activites over the Last 10+ years.

At the very least hounding him and pressuring other governments to not allow him sanctuary would have kept him on the run and unable to plan and execute this acts.

<snip>

I'm with Geo on this one. We need to find out who did this and make very sure that they (and anyone else who is like minded) find out that attacking Americans is a BAD thing, and doing so carries with it BAD consequences.

For those who don't like Americans claiming high moral ground, think about this: somebody just killed thousands, or more probably, tens of thousands of people for no reason other than to kill and cause terror. You will have to excuse us for taking the high moral ground in going after them.

golf_prez · #4 September 12th, 2001, 08:31 PM

I am surprised that the word "Armageddon" hasn't been referenced in the media (yet). But I did read this in the paper today next to a picture of the skeleton of the WTC.

"And they cast dust on their heads, and cried, weeping and wailing, saying, Alas alas, that great city where (we) were made rich ... for in one hour is she made desolate" - Revelation 18:19

Probably just media sensasionalism... but if you believe in God and the Bible, you can't help but wonder if we are living in the times as described in Revelation.

Puke · #5 September 12th, 2001, 08:32 PM

Geo is right. its not that we didnt see this coming, its that you cant do things to prevent this. what, eliminate airspace over cities? right. institute extremeist security policies at airports? thats giving into terrorism. my biggest complaint is 'why the heck dont we have an armed skycop on every single plane?' oooh, it costs money, and theres some sort of money shortage in America? give me a break! tightwads.

and you want SAM sites around the capitol? you dont think we have them? you dont think we have them in New York City? what exactly do you want them to do? shoot down every airliner not on a preapproved flight plan? thats really brilliant. It like the bombing of the USS Cole, its not that our port security sucks. we have guys patroling the deck with sidearms when the boat is at port. BUT, when its at a FRIENDLY port, those guns are UNLOADED because the risk of causing a political incident outweighs the risk to the boat. sam sites.. sheesh. that would make it safer to travel

golf_prez · #6 September 12th, 2001, 08:39 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Puke:
Geo is right. its not that we didnt see this coming, its that you cant do things to prevent this.

Democracy's greatest strength is our individual rights, which turns out to be our biggest weakness against those who wish to harm us.

Argh · #7 September 12th, 2001, 08:45 PM

<lol> Alpha, I think that a Palestinian would point at the thousands of their dead and maimed who were shot with American bullets during any argument about moral culpability, but I digress. . .

We have been hounding Bin Ladin, but he's like Batman. . . he's rich, extraordinarily intelligent, and well-connected politically. The guy has a finger in a lotta people's plots, and he was given sanctuary by the Taliban precisely because he's a dangerous man. I'm sure one or several of the factions there thought that having him around would discourage other nations from butting into their private civil war

Anyhow, I feel sorry for the Afgani people, because they're likely to get bombed again, and this time by their former allies. They have had the worst luck in the world, set as they are between the grumbling giant of Russia, the plots and terror of Iran, and the squabbles between India and Pakistan. The land is some of the most barren on Earth, and the people are extremely poor. . . the only things they own that are generally worth much are weapons and goats- see map at
http://education.yahoo.com/reference...ok/af/map.html

To sum up. . . the Taliban continue to deny his culpability in this horrific crime, and no one has had the balls to step forward and claim it.

Whenever I think seriously about the worst-case scenarios that could come out of this. . . I think about a terrorist cell whose members have been briefed to perform this one task. . . and then the other cells disappear into thin air. If we cannot establish a real tie to a real group, we'll probably make one up :P

So. . . we have long wait ahead of us, folks. I think that whatever's coming next, whether it's a declaration of war on a sovereign state, diplomacy or sanctions. . . it will not occur for at least 2 months, and probably longer.