War.... (Historical: 9/11 discussion thread)

[geoschmo]

quote:

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Originally posted by Puke:
as for explosive decompression, its only explosive when you have gaping holes ripped into the plane. and low calibur sidearms, especially with frangible or hollowpoint rounds, would probably be stopped by the fusealage. tazers, shock batons, KO gas (even in a canister delivered by the skycop) or gel rounds would be perfectly effective. I would stand by bullets tho, they have a long track record for getting the job done, and sometimes the risks are sufficient to mandate their use.

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Dude, the reason they call it "explosive" decompression is that the hole starts out small, and gets bigger, real fast.

And even low velocity rounds will penetrate an airplanes fusealage. Commercial aircraft fuselages are designed with the least amount and lightest material available. It's not exactly reynolds wrap or anything, but is itn't much better. They aren't designed to stop bullets. A bullet that can't puncture an aircraft fuselage would break your skin to be sure, but it isn't going to have any stopping power against a person detemined to cause you bodily harm.

And even if you had the "magic bullet" that kills people and won't punch holes in the side of the plane, you haven't answered how one guy is going to stop a team of terrorists.

On at least one of the planes hijacked yesterday, the flight crew kept the cockpit locked, but opened it up when the terrorists started hurting stewardesses and passengers. What's to stop a aircop from succumbing to the same demand?

It's just not a workable solution. Sorry. That's why they stopped doing it, as much as the money reasons.

Skycops are just not an effective deterant against this kind of terrorism. They may make the passengers feel safer, but they don't actually make them safer.

Geoschmo

[This message has been edited by geoschmo (edited 12 September 2001).]

[Puke]

no. it might be explosive as you describe on a space shuttle, but there is not enough of a pressure differential on a commercial flight to rend the plane appart. the times where there have been problems is when something has taken a chunk out of the plane and the wind sheer has torn it appart. even if bullets are not used, there are plenty of non lethal methods a skycop could use, and even if he is not a superhero, the presence of one would help to discourage would be terrorists. sure they might give into the same pressures that caused the pilots to unlock the door, but its better than nothing. I think having a guy with a gas canister is the best idea anyone has had.

sufice to say, we dont have those now, and nothing we come up with is going to save the dead folks on those four airplanes. now is the time for us to become the pig of a nation that everyone hates us for. to help the political parties that we favor at the moment overthrow those that are currently inconvinent to us. now is when we should be working to dismantle ideologies that work against our best interests, and to setup new puppet governments that will hopefully serve us better than the Last batch. no matter how many kinder more sensitive advocates for individual rights chime up about basic human values, thats what we are going to do, and keep doing. America is an Empire, and so are all of our NATO allies. people only point to us in distaste because they dont like looking at themselves.

[Hotfoot]

Solutions to problems with the sleeping gas problem:

-ensure that the essential crew, pilots, co-pilots, navigators, all have an independant air supply in the case of an emergency. Even their drop-down oxygen masks could be modified for the job.

-give pilots catheder bags. I think there's a john near the cockpit anyway. You could seal off everything after that.

-if for some reason the pilots are incapacitated as well, use the regular update code I mentioned earlier. If the pilots get knocked out, autopilots take over and level the plane out and keep it locked at a specific "safe" altitude.

[tesco samoa]

I am just back from one of the most frustrating days of work.

I almost lost it today.

All I heard was this country should pay. Bomb the F*&^ers back to the stone age. Bah Bah Bah.

Damn Stupid Ignorant People.

I walked up to one guy and told him that I resented what he was saying. First words were "You ******* have some Respect."

I then told him that as being an Irish Man I resented this Racial Sterotyping.

I asked him if England had a right to carpet bomb Northern Ireland or Ireland after a car bomb.

Know what the guy said.

Well that's different.

How I asked.

He would not answer.

That's too bad.

I hope cooler heads prevail in this.

Bombing a country and killing more innocent people is not the right answer.

If I offended anyone with this post I am truely sorry. That was not the intent of this post. I am just a little angry and want to vent some steam. And I trust the people in this forum to take it in stride.

If you feel I was wrong doing what I did today. That is ok. I understand. But I hope you understand why I did it as well.

May this post find you in good health and improving spirits.



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[LazarusLong42]

Tesco, I dare say cooler heads will prevail on the large scale. People like the ******* you spoke to rarely have any more political/military power than being a low-grade NCO or a police lieutenant.

Unfortunately, that sort of person may go around shooting up mosques, as has now happened at least once. I merely hope that the police and the justice system treat these people as exactly what they are--common criminals--rather than turning the other way while it happens.

LL

[Hotfoot]

Tesco: I agree with you. Frankly, I'm saddened by all the people I know who are saying "bomb the ****ing ****wits."

It really is not a bright moment for the world.

[tesco samoa]

it's scary seeing the world change. and it did change. Only time will show if it will get better or worse. Take care everyone.
I am off to have a pint with my dad and talk about our hero's ( Soccer, football hockey and movies) maybe with a little more vigor than usual. But it will be a good distraction. Talk to you all tomorrow.

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