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  #1  
Old September 7th, 2005, 06:39 PM
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Also - ammo containers are limited to a maximum warhead size (may be shot size) of 3 ISTR.

They are meant to resupply onlt small arms ammo etc, though because of the way the database is organised, may resupply some things they were not intended to (such as MLRS which has a weapon size (just checked - of 1 to enable quick resupply.

looks like ammo supply works off the weapon size and NOT warhead size. Weapon size variable is only used for resupply - so 203mm MLRS and the URAGAN are 1, to enable resupply quickly (palletised ammo), which puts them in the same "bracket" as rifle ammo.. so ammo containers will resupply them. A database quirk which could be utilised as a "cheat" by unscrupulous players, but nothing we can do about it (we wanted quick reload capacity for particular MLRS systems).

As a scenario designer - the AI knows nothing about ammo units. it will "kamikaze" ammo trucks at objectives, etc. HOWEVER - where the AI is static (delaying or defending) then ammo units placed close by (1 hex for most, 2 at half the supply rate for ammo dump and ammo bunker) defenders can be useful to extend the shots available for low round units (SAM, inf-SAM, inf-ATGM etc).

If the AI is defending/delaying - I would consider placing ammo bunkers (less chance of being destroyed to blow up with 1000lb bomb seconadary explosion effects beside key AI defensive units (inf-SAM, SAM with only 1-3 shots, sagger teams with but 4 ATGM etc). This would give the AI better "staying power" against human air strikes, and MBT.


cheers
Andy
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Old September 7th, 2005, 11:54 PM

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Wow! Now that is information. Sorry I missed in the manual. I really did look, but my eyes are old and tired! Sorry to bother you.

You really answered in great deal and this helps immensely. I appreciate the time each of you took to add something to the knowledge pile. I think I have it now.

And Jazz, I appreciate the kind words. More are "ON THE WAY!"

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Old September 9th, 2005, 11:50 AM

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Okay, I've got that down. I've discovered some things about these canisters.

1. They only replenish the weapon of the first slot. Any secondary weapons seem to remain with the same amount of ammo for their other weapons. Am I correct?

2. They replenish one unit at a time. They appear not to replenish other units until the first replenished unit moves away.

Example; I have three units adjacent to an ammo canister, all infantry units. Unit A gets some 40 points, maybe more, in one turn. Units B & C get nothing until A moves away from the canister.

3. It seems that once replenished, they cannot fire the replenished weapon in the same turn that they move away from the canister. Is that true? Do they have to wait one full turn before firing their primary weapon?

4. Canisters when suppressed or a unit "refilling" when suppressed stop the process. This makes sense.

Thanks,
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Old September 9th, 2005, 12:53 PM
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Quote:
WBWilder said:
Okay, I've got that down. I've discovered some things about these canisters.

1. They only replenish the weapon of the first slot. Any secondary weapons seem to remain with the same amount of ammo for their other weapons. Am I correct?
[/i]

They will replenish from slot 1 down to slot 4. if the thing is firing, it may not get the chance to fully top up slot 1. The slot 2+ weapons may also have a shot size too large for the cannister to replenish.

Quote:

2. They replenish one unit at a time. They appear not to replenish other units until the first replenished unit moves away.




Yes. We already mentioned in the manual (in the development history segment probably) that the old SSI SP games "feature" where ammo units gave supply to all units in range was removed. The supply unit services the first unit in the unit purchase order. It will only supply the next in sequence if in range if the first one is fully topped up, when it will give any surplus supply points to that next unit. And if the first unit is doing something like say firing then that may well not happen at all.

You cannot use the old SSI SP series games "trick" of buying one ammo truck, and then clustering an infinite number of units beside it and then all those infinite units got the full supply value of the ammo truck!.

You'll likely need 1 ammo unit "seller" per prospective "buyer". Hopwever, I find that 2 2-tube 81mm mortar sections both within 1 hex of the same ammo bunker can fire continuously for a full game as the resupply value of that (and the ammo dump) is the highest in the game. Move them to 2 hexes from the bunker and the tubes will run dry eventually (in which case stop both firing for 3-4 turns will fill em up). An ammo dump is NOT a good idea for supplying the mortars, as mortars will eventually attract incoming, and the dump is rather vulnerable (if reasonably cheap), where the ammo bunker is protected, though expensive.


Quote:

Example; I have three units adjacent to an ammo canister, all infantry units. Unit A gets some 40 points, maybe more, in one turn. Units B & C get nothing until A moves away from the canister.




When A is filled up, B will start to get supply. if A is firing continuously, B and C will get no or little supply as A is hogging it.

Cycle A,B and C through the ammo container. For quicker resupply, do that out of contact (do not fire and bomb up at the same time).

(In long campaigns, I like to add a canister to inf-SAM units in a light truck. Once I get them to thier overwatch position and unload them, I walk them away from the canister by 3-4 hexes and then later walk them back to it to top up as required, the light truck or APC then waiting nearby to carry off the sams and container package if the firing position needs a radical shift - like running away from some enemy flank attack !

Quote:

3. It seems that once replenished, they cannot fire the replenished weapon in the same turn that they move away from the canister. Is that true? Do they have to wait one full turn before firing their primary weapon?



That would be the normal movement rules. Are you looking at an ATGM or SAM or other missile (which if it moves too far cannot shoot) or trying to plot an arty unit (which cannot plot or fire indirect if it moves)?.

Quote:

4. Canisters when suppressed or a unit "refilling" when suppressed stop the process. This makes sense.

Thanks,
Wild Bill



low supression may allow some supply points, but "S" reduces the points available to transfer.
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Old September 10th, 2005, 12:22 AM

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Again, good answers all. Thanks Andy. I'm clear on the matter now.

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