Spartan Mod 0.2

[Frostmourne27]

Hmmm... If you zip it could you possibly include a rar too? My computer doesn't handle zips too well, and they usually turn out smaller, which is a bonus. BTW, this looks like it will turn out to be a neat mod.

[Arralen]

• You don't need to make every weapon you use. There are already Long Spears (check Arco), Short Swords and Javelins (and lots of other weapons). There's not much room stat-wise to 'squeeze' in another weapon without rendering another one 'obsolete' or breaking the balance.
• Pila weren't "armor piercing" but "shield piercing". we don't have seperate shields in Dom2 (and I think you can't pierce them in Dom3). Armor piercing missiles are a severe balance problem anyway, better use the standard javelins instead.
• The stats of the Hoplon are those of a light magical hide shield, not of a heavy infantry shield. Treat the Hoplon as a tower shield stat-wise, with at least "encumbrance: 2".
• The Hoplon was the name-giving shield of the Hoplites. It would have had little use for light troops, because it was too heavy and meant for forming an interlocking shield wall, not give maximum protection to skirmishers.
• If you want to follow the games' "naming convention" it should be "Lorica Segmentata" not "Lorica Segmentata armor". But there's already a "Lorica Segmentata" in the game I think - check Pythium.
• The "lorica segmentata" was a medium-late roman armor. Hoplites used various forms of plate cuirasses, light ones made from leather to ultra-heavy bronze casts. It was made for easy manufacturing and giving the troops ok protection while retaining their mobility. Hoplites formed a shield wall and wheren't that mobile (Phalanx). In fact, the roman concept of lighter armor, slightly lighter shield and short sword to stab with was developed to break up Phalanxes into smaller, mostly defenseless groups.
• The "Lorica Segmentata" is way too good. A non-magical prot-12 armor should have at least (enc 3) and defense (-1).
• Do not use 2 body armor over each other. While this may appear to work, it may cause all sorts of strange behaviour 'behind the scenes'.
• If you're making completely new units, don't forget to 'declare' the equipment slots. While this seems unnecessary for non-commanders, there could always be a player who GoRs them, resulting in very strange results
• "Weaponthane": Map move 2 for a heavy infantry is seriously unbalanced ..
• You complete forgot about helmets. Hoplites used heavy bronze cast helmets ...

Other than that its a great mod - keep up the work

[deadmeat1471]

although i agree with the balance issues totaly must remind you of one of my opening statements...

"this is a fictional nation who resemble in many ways the spartans of greece, but in this fictional land there will be inacuracys and fantasy elements. "

although being a big fan of history i mainly named the armor so i could remember which is which, lorica heavy armor , hoplon, 'a shield' etc, but as the mod progressed from the beginning it seems to be becomming more 'realistic' in terms of army structure, so i will definetly be modifying most of the issues you raised Arralen.

Thanks for the scruteny, and also thanks for possibly pursuading me back into a more historical spartan race
just today i was reading about the battle of Thermopylae, im interested heavily in all periods of history and alot of what you said i know but failed to thus far impliment
For certain your historical accuracys for armor will be implimented!

I find that after a while of modding you have to stop, step back and take a look at it to see what is insane because so far ive failed to notice the obvious insanitys of the mod :/

[deadmeat1471]

Progress... (to save people restating noted problems)


-Armor and weapon historical accuracys
-Helmets done
-Body Armors done
-Shields done


-Balance issues of overpowered armor and weapons
-pilum done
-heavy armour done


-Unit name changes
-Provostai - to be changed in 0.2c

[Arralen]

No problems with some "artistic freedom"

Just make sure you don't use names already in the game. This will not only confuse the players but the game engine as well, if they weren't only very similar but really the same accidently .
For standard (non-magical) equipment, better go with those items already existant - there are plenty of things to borrow from the original nations and themes. Makes balacing easier as well.
And if you really have to introduce equipment, make sure it sufficiently different from the 'generic' items but still balanced - if this doesn't work, it's obviously too similar to warrant using an item ID for it.

If you're heavily interested in this time period, you might want to try out the 'big' demos of "Gates of Troy", "Spartan" and "Chariots of War" by Slitherine Strategies Software UK Ltd if you not already know them.

[deadmeat1471]

ive played some slitherine games, spartan for one my interest isnt to just play any spartan game i feel like creating my own fantasy spartans in the dom2/3 world
much of what we talked about is being implimented as we speak mainly using already existing weapons where possible, but of course must have the corinthian helms!

[deadmeat1471]

Next order of battle, more units, the lack of units at moment is very insufficient, while leaving out archers and cavalry (nation weakness) i have a few ideas, javelin skirmishers, shortsword infantry (reminiscent of roman legions!) to break enemy once phalanx pin them.

seeing as spartan tactics to my knowledge heavily involved hopolites and phalanx, i will try to design a new array of them in the next release.