SE:V, I'll be honest

[marc420]

Played the Demo for awhile, then gave up. Game feels more like work. Like was said, just didn't grab me. Its a combination of things .. a UI that is very non-intuitive, always feel like I'm in the wrong place trying to do the wrong thing. But more than that. Maybe the fact that its mainly just SE IV's dataset, when I had long since moved on to playing mods in that game. Maybe its the bugs, all the things that just don't seem to work. Maybe its the 100 turn limit, and the thought that I'll be stopped from playing if the game ever does get interesting.

I'm long since sick of companies that release a game on a certain date to make the Christmas season. And a buggy demo at this point makes me think that's what's happening here. Usually I'd expect the last month of a game to be spent on play-balancing, most bugs should be long gone by then. But in this game, that seems to get little attention ... its just SEIV again. The feel seems to be to do nothing here and let the modders do the work later.

Partly I'm disappointed in the focus of the game. 3D means nothing to me, so when I see all the effort spent on 3D, it makes me think of other things that could have been done.

I'm interested in strategy gameplay. I'm interested in a strong AI. How much could have been done here if the focus wasn't on 3D? Too much I see SEIV, but with 3d. And with tools and spaces for modders maybe to improve, but not those improvements used in the demo.

Oh well ... I might come back after some patches and after the modders go to work. But for now, its pretty much a sure thing I ain't buying this one on release.

[Fyron]

This is actually one of the worst times to release a game. Christmas season is Nov/Dec. Sept./Oct. is bad because it is just at the start of school, so back to school shopping has generally tapped people out, and it is too early for most people to be doing Christmas shopping. Instead, they are more likely to buy nothing and save money for Christmas shopping in Nov./Dec.

Honestly, I don't think I'd buy this game on release either. Didn't buy SE4 for about 8 months, and that paid off.

[Uncle_Joe]

I havent been able to form a valid opinion on the gameplay yet because I its just too unstable for me. Way too many crash outs to try and make a real investment in learning it.

But from the little I've been able to play, I do agree that something appears to be missing. I know its not just me being tired of the genre because I've been away from SE4 for a while and I wanted to get back into it. I came here to see what was up and I saw that the SE5 demo had just hit. So there was definately an interest factor there for me.

As other have said, it does sort of seem like work. The ship construction which should be one of the coolest features seems cumbersome and not intuitive (engines can go anywhere, guns on the back can shoot to the front etc). It doesnt help that the game repeatedly crashes out during both ship construction and the combat simulator.

I'm definately going to approach the final release with caution. Like others, I really WANT to like the game, but so far I havent been wow'ed in any way. I'm hoping for a much better AI than SE4, but I'm being encouraged by what I've been reading about it. SE4's AI never gave a feeling of immersiveness. It agreed to treaties/request and never bothered to follow through. There was no feeling of dealing with other empires (which both MOO2 and the Civ series have managed). I dont expect a strategic and tactical genious from the AI, but something so that you can at least feel like its another actual faction. So far, it appears that SE5 has no done a lot to change that issue.

On the positive side, the change in the combat engine appears welcome, but again I have to reserve final judgement due to crashing issues. In theory, I like how you have to explore the star systems too. How it actually works out remains to be seen.

Still, I'm tentatively looking forward to the release. I'll keep an eye on what others feel about it and I'll see what the patch/upgrade situation looks like. I'm hoping that I can get even a fraction of the enjoyment I got out of SE3 and SE4 (both WELL in excess of the investment).

[frightlever]

I stopped posting here about a week or two ago when people with a negative view were more or less getting hounded off the forums. Interesting to come back to this as one of the latest threads with a majority of the posters unlikely to buy the game at release.

I want SEV to succeed as much as the next guy but I'm not emotionally invested in MM or Aaron Hall. I give him money he gives me a game, much the same as a supermarket and food. If he was doing it for free then fair enough but he's doing it for money (and no, I don't work for free either but I don't expect blind faith from my clients either. It would be nice though...) and specifically he's doing it for Strategy First's money and we'll be paying them. By all accounts from the beta testers he's ignored valid concerns over the UI and makes next to no effort to engage his users. This isn't charity so could the next guy who tells me MM is a one man band and we should cut him some slack please explain why?

In fact if you want a real conspiracy theory SEV can be buried in mediocrity while SF has their East European coders knock out SE6 the real time strategy game a la Warcraft 3. Jagged Alliance 3D anyone?

I really want to buy SEV and enjoy it and I'll probably STILL buy the game on release if it hits Steam. The real question is whether I'll still be playing it in five years time.

And to Marc420, my brother in disdain for 3D froo froo crap, Amen!

[Fyron]

frightlever said:
I stopped posting here about a week or two ago when people with a negative view were more or less getting hounded off the forums.

Did I miss some posts somewhere? I never saw anyone "hounded off the forums." Sure, there were a few people reading way too much into things, but not much more than that. It's a discussion forum, so of course people will post some contrary opinions to whatever else gets posted. That is hardly hounding anyone off the forums.

[Black_Knyght]

frightlever said:
I stopped posting here about a week or two ago when people with a negative view were more or less getting hounded off the forums

Interesting perspective. I seem to recall feeling pretty much the same way, though I was basically very politely told I was full of it and "biased".

Glad to see I'm not the only one who saw that around here....

[Captain Kwok]

To clarify, the "only a few things" comment was directed at players who have only a couple of items standing between them and being happy about the game. Not everyone who's had problems with the SE:V demo.

BK, I never saw anyone call you full of it. I merely said you went in biased because you made a point of posting a lot that you weren't going to abandon SE:IV for SE:V just because it was new. And it was mostly a jest as I added a "razz'.

I hope no one thought I was hounding them. My goal was for players who were having issues to forward them to MM etc. Hence most of reply posts was directed players to report bugs/annoyances... so nah.

[Matryx]

My goodness, another conspiracy pops up. Can you still not see that no-one has intended to drive anyone away?
Apologies and clarifications were forthcoming the last time you said this, and now given that you now say you feel we told you that you were full of it, I dread to think how you read the most innocuous posts :/

In all frank honesty, other people's concerns about a game don't get me bothered - there's plenty of other people I would end up playing with, so you don't see me jumping to defend any point here or there unless I know it's incorrect and no-one else has explained it. I *know* I'm going to enjoy the game, so I'm happy to sit quietly and leave others to their opinions.
I would agree with Kwok's statement though, historically you've been fairly anti-SE5 so yes you do come across as biased - not that it's necessarily a *bad* thing mind you - you can't ever get a balanced opinion on a subject, but again as Kwok said - there's nothing to debate really - If you like it, great. If you don't - share the reasons and move on (er, back) to other games.

I've said it before and I'll say it again - the only reason I ever hung out with the community is because they've always been so level-headed and welcoming. Hell, I take 2 or 3 year breaks between posts sometimes and yet the community doesn't change. There is no hounding out of the forums for negative opinions, but equally there's no need to repost the same things over and over. Directions to adress things straight to MM is purely because Aaron is very distant from the community as a whole (imo), but when people send things to him he does read them, given these facts now perhaps you can see that the perceived hounding you had was merely misinterpreting helpful advice?

[Black_Knyght]

Captain Kwok said:
To clarify, the "only a few things" comment was directed at players who have only a couple of items standing between them and being happy about the game. Not everyone who's had problems with the SE:V demo.

BK, I never saw anyone call you full of it. I merely said you went in biased because you made a point of posting a lot that you weren't going to abandon SE:IV for SE:V just because it was new. And it was mostly a jest as I added a "razz'.

I hope no one thought I was hounding them. My goal was for players who were having issues to forward them to MM etc. Hence most of reply posts was directed players to report bugs/annoyances... so nah.

In the interest of clarity, let me state that it seemed to me that you were adressing me personally, since the post was directed to me. And I didn't realize or catch that you might be "razzing" me. Being refered to as biased because I had my doubts and expressed them also tends to raise my hackles a bit. I frequently say what I think or feel, but I always give things a fair chance to prove me wrong.

As to being "full of it", no - no one has directly used those words, but I have been told "your wrong,that's not what's happening here" or "i don't see that around here" or "that doesn't happen around here". Basically - I'm full of it if I say it seems like negative viewpoints are being hounded. And yet, obviously it's NOT strictly my point of view. I've quoted others with the same perspective for a reason. I'm not trying to pick a fight or be difficult. I am trying to point out something evident not only to me, but several other people here as well. evident enough that some have even stated they quit coming here for a while because of that.

I have said many times I'm not abandoning SEIV for SEV, that's true. I never once said I wouldn't give SEV it's fair shake, only that I wasn't in favor of the changes that were being incorporated into it. When the Demom was released I downloaded it, tried it, expressed my problems with it, acted on the suggested responses, and still didn't feel happy with it. I continued to try to see beyond the issues that bug me, and still nothing changed. And, once again, I expressed what and why I wasn't happy with it. My not being rabidly in favor of the game has drawn a fair bit of flack.

[RonGianti]

frightlever said:
I stopped posting here about a week or two ago when people with a negative view were more or less getting hounded off the forums.

*snip*

Funny, I feel exactly the opposite. I'm feeling hounded off the forums because a handful of people hijack threads with constant whining about minor issues.

I'm enjoying the demo and made to feel like I should not be because of minor issues.

In all the threads I've read, I've seen the beta testers here answering questions with more patience than I would have for the constant whiners. I've seen a number of posts that read more like a list of demands than questions and instead of ignoring them, the beta testers patiently answer questions and acknowlege issues.