Conceptual Balance (Discussion) - Page 10

JaydedOne · #91 October 30th, 2006, 11:44 AM

Quote:

Nerfix said:
Abysia's problem with aging is twofold:

- Almost all mages start as old, even Anathem. Salamanders and Warlock Apperentics
- Abysians have tiny miny lifespans and are old at age of ~32. This makes them to be propotionaly more likely to rack afflictions from old age. Warlocks start with age of 38 IIRC.

From what I recall from this weekend's game in which I played Abysia, the lower-ranked Abysian priests, the Warlock Apprentices, and the Annointed of Rhuax all begin "young". You can't say "almost all" when a full half of them don't. The choice in that nation is a hard one -- you can choose cheaper, weaker versions of each type of mage/priest without old age or you can choose more expensive, old units. The Annointed is the exception and comes with his own issue (i.e. his size, which makes him a target for AI scripting.)

Nerfix · #92 October 30th, 2006, 11:48 AM

Let me fire up the game and check...

Yes, you are correct, but A. Salamanders have age of 28(33) and will occasionaly start with old age. So that leaves us with Blood 1 Warlock Apperentices and the 440 Gold Anointeds of Rhuax as the only reliably young mages. Anointeds are great though.

This is EA Abysia. Let me see the other ages...

Nerfix · #93 October 30th, 2006, 11:51 AM

MA Abysia's A. Salamanders start Old with the age of 34(33). Their Warlock Apperentices also start Old with age of 35(35)...Their only reliable young mage is the Demonbred.

Late Era Abysia, I think that the Newst and Sanguine Apperentices are only ones who don't start as Old.

JaydedOne · #94 October 30th, 2006, 11:57 AM

Yeah, I agree that their old age might be a bit overboard, especially with the Death Resistance that I saw discussed earlier and the way it minimizes the use of the Growth scale to protect against. I know that some part of me was wondering why I was investing so heavily in mages when a full half of them were going to die sooner than later.

The other downside there is that Abysia really is an inflexible nation in terms of unit choices. Really, what else are you supposed to buy if NOT their mages?

Nerfix · #95 October 30th, 2006, 12:00 PM

Demonbreds (who are good) and, uh, Newts and Sanguine Acos who can cast, errrr, Combustion and Bleed...

B0rsuk · #96 October 30th, 2006, 12:03 PM

If I'm not mistaken, Fire path substracts exactly 5 years per level from max age. Demo doesn't let me examine Abysia unless I play against it...

Nerfix · #97 October 30th, 2006, 12:06 PM

Perhaps Fire magic is one reason for Abysia's age craziness, I'm not sure.

dirtywick · #98 October 30th, 2006, 12:06 PM

Aging with Abysia MA isn't really that huge of a problem IMO. First thing is they can forge Boots of Youth, but not for a while, so mid/late game age can be a non-issue for Abysia but not most other nations. Second thing is if you're going to play them you should be blood hunting, and with blood nations you'd usually take Growth anyway which makes a noticable impact in age afflictions, although you're still going to be seeing mages die. The last thing is you'll probably be taking Order as well since their troops are so expensive, so replacing mages isn't a big deal between that and all the fire gems you get every turn and the lack of things to do with them.

Does Old Age need a bit of adjusting? Probably, I don't find it that awful except for not taking Growth bar the occasional guy who gets diseased the turn you recruit it, but in general in my experience mages last a few years.

Nerfix · #99 October 30th, 2006, 12:17 PM

Well, judging from the flavour text at least the Warlock Apperentices should be young since they are said to be "young Abysians".

Endoperez · #**100** October 30th, 2006, 12:29 PM

Quote:

Nerfix said:
MA Abysia's A. Salamanders start Old with the age of 34(33). Their Warlock Apperentices also start Old with age of 35(35)...Their only reliable young mage is the Demonbred.

Late Era Abysia, I think that the Newst and Sanguine Apperentices are only ones who don't start as Old.

EA Warlocks also start with 35/35 years and Anathemant Dragons 35/32 years old, so using this logic EA Abysia could also be said to have no "reliably old" mages. They could always start young!

Quote:

B0rsuk said:
If I'm not mistaken, Fire path substracts exactly 5 years per level from max age. Demo doesn't let me examine Abysia unless I play against it...

I think it's only 2, at least for human-types with 50 years of maxage. I think it is 5 years for e.g. Agarthans, though.

This doesn't affect Abysians, though. Maxage of Anathemant mages seems to be 32, despite the amount of Fire magic they have.