Corrected UK OOB

[Listy]

Mobhack said:
yes - 432 Mk 3 is already in (both the naked and protection pack versions, plus the "what-if" IFV version).

Also looking into the new Mastiff (cougar) MPV vehicles that may replace saxon:
Cougar

Cheers
Andy

I belive the FV432Mk3 is replaceing Saxon, while the Mastiff Is more of a special issue job Like the Snatch Rover.

[narwan]

I'm working on a couple of scenario's of NATO v WP battles using some less conventional formations like NATO's heavy recon squadrons. I've got a question about the UK's recon squadrons. I've been using the following OBs a lot (as it seems to be pretty accurate although perhaps not completely perfect):
http://orbat.com/site/history/histor...o/oob1989.html
http://orbat.com/site/history/histor...arsawpact.html


The NATO OB for 1989 gives the following for the UK's recon squadrons:

e. 9th /12th Royal Lancer Recce Regiment - Wolfenbuttel, FRG: 3 Sultan, 4 Ferret
1) Close Recon Squadron: 10 Sultan, 40 Scimitar, 20 Striker, 20 Spartan, and 5 Ferret
2) 2 Medium Recon Squadrons: 8 Sultan, 16 Scorpion, and 4 Ferret each

f. 13th /18th Royal Hussars Recce Regiment - Herford, FRG: 3 Sultan, 4 Ferret
1) Close Recon Squadron: 10 Sultan, 40 Scimitar, 20 Striker, 20 Spartan, and 5 Ferret
2) 2 Medium Recon Squadrons: 8 Sultan, 16 Scorpion and 4 Ferret each

b. The Blues and Royals: 3 Sultan, 4 Ferret
1) Close Recon Squadron: 10 Sultan, 40 Scimitar, 20 Striker, 20 Spartan, and 5 Ferret
2) 2 Medium Recon Squadrons: 8 Sultan, 16 Scorpion, and 4 Ferret each

While that is completely different from the formation in the game, the game's squadron seems to assume that these units were mixed up and turned into 5 combined squadrons (the difference is 2 Scorpions and the Sultans and Ferrets in that case). Am I right in assuming this? Am I also right in assuming that the Sultans are left out because they are command vehicles with little combat role? What about the Ferrets though?

Narwan

[Mobhack]

Depends on which orgnisation the recce regiment is - UK recce formations change every 5 minutes it seems, and there are usually at least 2 variants at the go at the same time (like BAOR and UK). And if deployed, then "extras" can turn up - e.g. the striker was supposed to be being retired but showed up being used in Iraq <g>.

1) The ferrets are probably just liason vehicles - like "tin jeeps", used to go visit the supported formation HQ and so forth, or for the CSM to toddle about in when doing admin tasks. Not really needed in-game as they are not battlefield troops as such. Could be useful for say supply convoy escort scenarios?.

2) I cannot see any reason for 10 (ten) sultans in a squadron (= Company). 2 I might believe. If command and control vehicles - left out as not of any use to the game (plus special "command vehicles" are a kill-me-quick sign to your opponent), but it may also be the original web site organiser confusing these with the spartan (used for the assault troops), or possibly the samaritan (ambulance) or the Sampson(?) recovery/fitters vehicles. Spartans would do OK for SHQ vehicles to stand for sultans, if wanted.

Cheers
Andy

[narwan]

I'll take that as a good thing since it means I can 'tweak' the squadron somewhat to fit my purpose without it being to much off the mark. I'm trying to use formations that come as close as possible to their probable wartime configuration. And maps based on the terrain where they would likely be fighting. Against likely opponents. But when it come to the heavy recon battallions of the different nations it's hard to find the needed info. I do have the dutch and germans in detail now though (those appear in two other scenario's). Now I'm digging for the UK and/or Belgian formations.
Do you know which UK units (if any) where deployed on the inner german border as first line delaying troops? Where those heavy recon battallions as with other nations?

Narwan

[Mobhack]

Wiki is usually a good starter Formation Reconnaissance regiment

As to who did what and when and where - try looking at the regiment histories at www.army.mod.uk - here is 2RTR History. Regiments (cavalry or infantry) re-role from time to time.

Note that UK does not have "heavy" recce regiments, like US Armored cavalry, or the FRG ones with Leopard tanks etc. UK recce units are focussed on "makee looksee" and not "makee fightee" - so have only enough firepower to keep themselves out of trouble.

The UK recce regiments would be used as part of the screening forces forward of the BAOR deployment areas - delaying and reporting, using the swingfires to attrite any enemy armour that got too "frisky", and calling in air and arty etc to do the main work. The radios of the regt, and its mobility are the primary weapons.

Cheers
Andy

[narwan]

Thanks, that'll help sort things out. I'll probably use the UK squadron for an advance mission, not a border delay so the border deployment is less important in this case. I'm hoping to make the scenario's (4 in the works sofar) into challenging PBEM scenario's (for both sides challenging). And none of them will be ME's. Fingers crossed!

Narwan