Repulsion strategies

[Agrajag]

Ironhawk said:
For the record, there are plenty of strategies to defeat a blessed nation that does not require the use of a bless.

The point of this thread is to list such strategies, so why don't you write them down instead of merely informing us of their existence?

[Ironhawk]

Agrajag said:
The point of this thread is to list such strategies, so why don't you write them down instead of merely informing us of their existence?

Actually, the poster said that he wanted a bless strategy to repulse a bless strategy. I didnt want to take the thread off-topic, only to point out that the only way to beat a bless is not another bless.

Since you are interested: blesses normally rely on smaller numbers of high power units. The logical counter to this is Astral Magic, which is extremely powerful vs single units. Paralyze comes to mind in particular. Of course Ryleh, by default, will pretty much slaughter any bless strategy. Also, any nation that has H3 mages could Smite the hell out of a blesser - no research needed.

[DrPraetorious]

To be explicit - I want this thread to be about non-bless-rush tactics for fighting bless-rush. I'm sorry if my original post is confusingly worded.

Unfortunately, strong blessers generally have a high MR, and I have not had a lot of success with smite or paralyze against strong bless troops - except when backing up other strong bless troops (as ME ermor, shadow vestels with archtheurgs smiting in the background did quite nasty things to a nature 9/water 9 machaka.)

That said, when all I have are screening troops and archers, I find that lightning bolt is a better bet - it still always hits and no MR to worry about.

[Huzurdaddi]

Ironhawk said:
Of course Ryleh, by default, will pretty much slaughter any bless strategy.

Indeed.



25 Vans F9W9 vs. 25 Illithid Soldiers ( had they been simple Illithids this combat would have been over far quicker -- further in a rush you will not have Illithid soldiers in this quanity they cost far too much resources ) and 115 lobo guards.

Note that rlyeh had a whole bunch of research done which may have skewed the results. This combat is near a tipping point, btw. If I add in a few hundred more gold ( ~ 500 +-) of chaff then rlyeh wins.

[Graeme Dice]

Huzurdaddi said:
Note that rlyeh had a who bunch of research done. Which may have skewed the results. This combat is near a tipping point, btw. If I add in a few hundred more gold ( ~ 500 +-) of chaff then rlyeh wins.

Is it possible to mod how long the Illithid paralysis lasts for? This might make a difference since they were initially balanced when their paralysis was permanent.

[Ironhawk]

Huzurdaddi said:
25 Vans F9W9 vs. 25 Illithid Soldiers ( had they been simple Illithids this combat would have been over far quicker -- further in a rush you will not have Illithid soldiers in this quanity they cost far too much resources ) and 115 lobo guards.

I'm really surprised by this result. Seems counter to all my experiences playing and fighting ryleh. But I will freely admit that I havent actually tested it against a full on rush.

[Teraswaerto]

Quietly,

It seems to me that Arco would have had much more success with Sleep rather than Lightning Bolt, and that Chariots and Myrmidons are the worst possible choice of troop for fighting Niefel giants.

[Quietly]

They had plenty of other troops as well, I'm not sure what troops you would have thought would have turned the tide... if they didnt have as large a horde as you'd like, I'm sure they spent their resources on myrms because their gold went to mages... which was a smart move, considering I could have killed hundred(s) more trashy troops, as I had low fatigue and full life after dispatching that 150 or so (with 4 giants...)

As for, the main battle, sleep vs lightning bolt... really it matters little because of the 5 turn scripting limit. I lined all my giants up at the back row, and sat a couple solitary militia at various points in the middle... everyone on hold + attack... in this case they blew off their first 4 rounds of spells as lightning bolt, with 0 jotun militia killed (spell innacuracy vs a single target)... they could have just as easily blown off 4 rounds of sleep with no kills. (mind you sleep is a relatively short range spell)

once you get beyond the 5th round, there is no more choosing sleep or choosing anything... the battle would proceed exactly the way it did... the ai autocasting whatever it did, and arcosphale being slaughtered.

[Teraswaerto]

The spell AI likes to cast Sleep, and 30 range isn't that short. It targets the biggest creatures, so I think some giants would've been put to sleep, after which they would die even to militia.

Barbarians or predatory lizards would be a good choice against the giants, with their higher damage weapons, and since armor doesn't really help.

I can't really say if Arco could've won, just throwing some ideas on how to deal with Niefel giants out there.