SFTC Lite

President_Elect_Shang · #1 January 17th, 2007, 06:02 PM

I have updated the heading description to clarify the difference between these two version of the same mod:

SFTC: The components progress in an SE4 fashion; that is they are Generational. This version structures progression and allows retro-construction of ships, bases, fighters, etc.

SFTC-Lite: The components progress in an SE5 fashion; that is they are Progressive. There is less structure in progression and no retro-construction.

Q: Ok PES but what is "retro-construction"?

A: Lets say we are allies and I am two "tech levels" above you. You are in a war and want to field ships with better technology for an added advantage to your forces. You pay me to design and build the best ships I can. I do and sell them to you as "fleet quality ships for my empire". In truth the ships are old technology for me even if they are new technology for you. That is retro-building. To the best of my knowledge this can't be done in SE5; unless I missed a toggle button.

Phoenix-D · #2 January 17th, 2007, 06:15 PM

You can retro with SE5, but in stock its a pain in the *** (you have to make a "dummy" ship design with EVERY component on it, repeat when you get tech upgrades).

In a mod, you can include additional components that just have a different level progression. Mine is including "prototype" (+3 levels, 300% cost) and "out of date" (-3 levels, 20% cost) components for example..

President_Elect_Shang · #3 January 17th, 2007, 06:32 PM

How do you manage to select components that were developed three levels ago and place them on a new design? Or do you mean the components themselves are linear in progression. So retro-construction for you would be deducting (for example) 300% from a component that has advanced 100% over each of the last three levels. Poof instant -3 levels. That still isn't really retro, even if that is very close. Also with the SFTC you can apply mounts to retro-built ships. So if you want an old style missile launcher that has the latest missile (mount) you can do that. You could also build the most advanced missile launcher with an old missile (mount) or any number of combinations. I would term what you are doing with the mounts as something else. Definitely not retro-construction; more like reversed engineering.

Edited: Also keep in mind by retro-construction I am not saying "use an old saved design". I mean something from scratch. The P-D Empire wants a Light Cruiser built with the best I have and built to their specifications and layout. Fine tell me what you want and I will make it fresh just for you, not happy want something adjusted? Hay no problem. Saving designs of old tech is still close but just not there yet.

Phoenix-D · #4 January 17th, 2007, 06:56 PM

No, I mean there are three components. No subtlety at *all*, but it works.

The reason I did it like that was the Prototypes. They're there to give the player an idea of what he'll get when he researches a field, and they actually show up before that's researched.

Say, Laser Weapons:
Research Physics 1, and you get Laser Weapons tech area and the Prototype Laser.
Research Laser Weapons and the prototype goes up to the next level, and the standard laser becomes available.

I could probably do a similar effect with mounts, but I haven't tried that. The tricky part is getting them to respect the level formulas.

By saving designs, I mean do this:
Make a hull. Cram one of every component that fits onto it. Copy that hull and lay it out as you like when the time comes. It actually won't work as I was hoping, because you couldn't add additional old components to it.

Suicide Junkie · #5 January 17th, 2007, 07:13 PM

Antique designing?

Can't you pick up one of the low level components and Shift-click to duplicate more of them?

Slick · #6 January 17th, 2007, 07:25 PM

I don't think there is a way to pick a low level component unless it is already in a design, hence the dummy designs.

The right answer here is a change to the design screen to allow picking not-the-latest components.

edit: you are also severely limited on what you can do while you are "holding" a component.

Phoenix-D · #7 January 17th, 2007, 07:45 PM

SJ: you can, and that makes the concept workable. Thanks.

Slick: True, but I can't do anything about that.. Thus, emailed MM about it, then set to finding workarounds.

Kind of like how Pirates and Nomads really needed point generation from components, but SJ found a workaround that did what was needed until those abilities were added.