Brainstorming : LA Man, Vs LA Utgard

Saxon · #1 February 9th, 2007, 08:11 AM

Huh, I will double check that. Also good to know about the message, that is new to me. Takes a fairly big bite out of the spy�s power, as it does not take much to boost PD up a bit and throw in a patrolling army. It will cost them, but the chance of really hitting a human is a lot lower.

Kalin · #2 February 9th, 2007, 11:09 AM

From the description, he's using Woodsman with a nature 9 bless, and water mages (Skrattis) set to cast quickness on them. This is a really effective giant setup because the giants will cross the battle way too fast for your archers do enough damage, and since they are berserked, they won't break due to morale. The giants effectively gains 2 str, 2 prot, from berserk, 1 def from quickness (3-2 from berserk), and 3 atk without touching experience. Effectively making them into powerhouses that you can't hope to compete with on even grounds.

Here's the choices you have:

1. Try to out strategize them. The above giant strategy is heavily gold dependent (and pratically zero resource). You can try various tactics such as spies or just out right raiding to cut his gold supply. Giants always lacks numbers, and their PD is absolutely abysmal, so this is probably the most effectly option, IMO.

2. Should you have to face the gaints in battle, the one thing that they do seem vulnerable to is fatigue. So my suggestion is to try using Curse of Stones and a lot of chaff units to get the giants to tire themselves out. Bringing some priests along to sermon the troops if you try this, they will take massive innitial losses.

3. The third option isn't too reliable by itself, but can work with the above, but would need a lot more mages. Essentially, try to put some few elite infantry(wardens/defenders) together and set your mages to cast Body Ethereal and Luck. If you space them correctly, while the giants are busy with your chaff, your mages will be able to buff your units into something capable of taking the giants on.

4. The fourth option requires that you be able to forge Bags of Winds. If you can get one of your mages high enough to do so, forging this and equiping your Magister Arcane with them will do wonders. Script them to spam Thunder Strike. The Air Elemental that comes with the bag of wind will distract the giants long enough for you to pull this off. (Without them, the giants will be in your face, and you will kill your own troops.)

Master Shake · #3 February 9th, 2007, 12:49 PM

If you have access to astral 2 mages, Soul Slay is probably your best option. Giants rely on few, very tough units. Soul Slay kills units regardless of the nunber of HP. Northern Lights banner is expensive (40 astral gems and I think Constr 6). A Starshine Skullcap (+1 astral - requires 2 or 3 astral to build) and Crystal Coin (+1 Astral - requires s2e2 to build) are cheaper, but only affect one mage. If he desn't have mages out in the field, use the +1 astral empowerment that boosts all mages on the field. Also, stick a Medallion of Focus on.

Kalin · #4 February 9th, 2007, 01:38 PM

Hmmm... I dunno, with that kind of setup, you're talking about at least 3 mage turn for one giant per turn (for the items alone). I'm not saying that it won't work, but I bet Utgard can pump out giants faster than that, and unless you put down a ton of chaff like I mentioned, a bunch of berserk, quickened giants will be in your face in a few turns. You'll be lucky if you can kill 2 giants with one of those mages. Losing a battle with a bunch of mage decked out in items would be disastrous. I don't think he will have enough astral gems to pull it off more than once. Also keep in mind that Utgard has no problem casting Antimagic.

JulienLeo · #5 February 11th, 2007, 07:20 AM

Quote:

Kalin said:
From the description, he's using Woodsman with a nature 9 bless, and water mages (Skrattis) set to cast quickness on them. This is a really effective giant setup because the giants will cross the battle way too fast for your archers do enough damage, and since they are berserked, they won't break due to morale. The giants effectively gains 2 str, 2 prot, from berserk, 1 def from quickness (3-2 from berserk), and 3 atk without touching experience. Effectively making them into powerhouses that you can't hope to compete with on even grounds.

Actually, it is even a bit worse than that ... He is indeed using woodsmen, but he is not using Skrattis at all. The quickness effect looks like it is part of the bless, so I think he got a W9N9 pretender ... the bless effect of water add a got bit of defence to the giants, making them really tough. He is just using one or two priest to spam bless ... *frowns*

Well, the goods news are that, according to the score graphs (which were kept enabled) he really really sucks in research ... but well, as it was said, the woodmens are real powerhouse ... and even if I haven't seen a single Skratti on the battle field, well ... honestly it is not as if it looks like he was really needing them.

Curse of stone looks like a great idea, but I don't seems to get the idea about the bags of winds ... I think the air elemental won't last a few seconds against a horde of giant.