i just ordered the game

Nick_K · #1 February 18th, 2007, 09:43 PM

The item manual is great, but there doesn't seem to be much extra in the spell manual compared to the game except for the stats for summoned creatures. There are also a few omissions (gem cost isn't included for battlefield spells. not all national spells are listed) and mistakes (one of the ermor national spells listed in general summonings, several obvious mistakes where comments by the writer were mistakenly left in the final draft) and at least one misleading description (undead mastery).
I kind of got the impression it was tacked on as an afterthought, or as padding. I'd much prefer the addition of flavour elements like short stories or vignettes illustrating gameplay elements or backstory. The old manual for sid meier's pirates or the MOO3 manual had bits like these and they really help the world come alive.

Gandalf Parker · #2 February 18th, 2007, 10:00 PM

Well you can always give us a taste of what you mean, and maybe you can do the manual for Dom4. Thats how the Dom3 manual got done by a player.

crumply · #3 February 18th, 2007, 10:46 PM

i ordered the game from gamers front: i thought that was the only option.

you think they have a department entitled "fulfillment"? If so, i hope they give me a good review. I really would like to play.

Nick_K · #4 February 18th, 2007, 11:53 PM

I'm not much of a fiction writer myself - at least, I haven't tried since I was a kid, but I agree that fan-submitted work would be best for that sort of thing given Illwinter's limited resources.

Gandalf Parker · #5 February 19th, 2007, 12:28 AM

Ive worked with alot of programmers.
And believe me, you dont want programmers writing user documentation.

Archonsod · #6 February 19th, 2007, 01:01 AM

It would certainly be thinner.

It's a good point about the background though. Dominions has always had (at least for me) the feeling that it's a distinct world, but without the backstory you only ever see the edges. It's especially true with the new ages letting you 'see' empires rise and fall, it's just a shame the player doesn't get much chance to get a real feel for those empires.

That said, I suppose it does encourage you to use your imagination while playing, just like back in the good old days...

Endoperez · #7 February 19th, 2007, 05:38 AM

Quote:

Archonsod said:
It would certainly be thinner.

It's a good point about the background though. Dominions has always had (at least for me) the feeling that it's a distinct world, but without the backstory you only ever see the edges. It's especially true with the new ages letting you 'see' empires rise and fall, it's just a shame the player doesn't get much chance to get a real feel for those empires.

That said, I suppose it does encourage you to use your imagination while playing, just like back in the good old days...

Actually, reading the descriptions of all the units, commanders, possible summons, and eventually heroes (of all the ages the nation exists in) is enough to give quite a good picture of the various nations. About the only things missing are "between the ages" things, like how did the Seal Guards of EA Agartha fail, or exactly what was the Malediction of Ulm about.

Endoperez · #8 February 19th, 2007, 05:31 AM

Quote:

Nick_K said:
1) The item manual is great, but there doesn't seem to be much extra in the spell manual compared to the game except for the stats for summoned creatures.

2) There are also a few omissions (gem cost isn't included for battlefield spells. not all national spells are listed) and mistakes (one of the ermor national spells listed in general summonings, several obvious mistakes where comments by the writer were mistakenly left in the final draft) and at least one misleading description (undead mastery).

3) I kind of got the impression it was tacked on as an afterthought, or as padding. I'd much prefer the addition of flavour elements like short stories or vignettes illustrating gameplay elements or backstory. The old manual for sid meier's pirates or the MOO3 manual had bits like these and they really help the world come alive.

1) There's not much more information in the manual than in the in-game descriptions. However, those little details can be rather important. As an example, Bone Melter's instant Death effect doesn't affect ethereal creatures according to the description. Mechanics-wise, the Death damage is Mundane (non-magical), which means that etherealness has the usual 75% chance of negating all that damage. That leaves ethereal creatures with 25% chance to be affected by Bone Melter - that's much better than the description implies! Blade Wind, Maggots, Earthquake and Bone Grinding also deal mundane damage. Earthquake's damage (8 points of armor-piercing damage) can also be negated by a successful Defense roll.
Oh, and Petrify paralyzes for about 7 turns.
And Acid Storm causes an Armor of Achilles effect on all units in the battlefield, destroying all non-magical armors.
And Song of Bravery spellsong of Man stacks with itself up to +5 morale.

The manual is also a great help when you don't want to (or can't) launch up Dom3 for testing or checking.

2) There are indeed few omissions. Earth Grip and Earth Meld lower defense, and this isn't mentioned. The effect of the 'Def' special effect isn't explained (fortunately it's quite simple to guess what it does). There is a thread about typos in the manual, and it is quite lengthy.

National global spells were forgotten from the manual. You can download a pdf file that has them from Shrapnel's Dom3 downloads page.

The number of required gems isn't one of the omitted things, though. It's directly related to fatigue of the spell (1 gem per 100 points of fatigue). While it isn't stated that e.g. Niefel Flames takes two gems, it is shown that it takes 200 fatigue to cast it...

3) As with fatigue/gems, there's something of a requirement to read between the lines in some cases. Undead Mastery, as an example, states that the caster takes control of ALL the undead on the battlefield, but it also states that the spell is easily negated by magic resistance. There are few contradictions such as these, and a number of minor omissions, but very few major mistakes (such as the missing national globals). I might even agree that parts of the manual seem to be put together in a hurry. However, I don't feel the spell list is extraneous or used as padding. It'd be quite expensive to do that, for one. 300-page paper manuals are rare for a reason!