newby's guide to ship and fleet strategy

PsychoTechFreak · #1 February 25th, 2002, 12:37 AM

1. Don't get Hurt
2. Ram

It is just a guess but maybe the kamikaze strategy just works if you load at least one warhead ?

Now, to something different:
Has anybody checked out the "until all weapons gone" button ? In many of my simulations, my fleets have done a better job with this button checked. First they knock out the weapons and then they sweep the battlefield from the wracks.

TerranC · #2 February 25th, 2002, 06:01 AM

quote:
Originally posted by PsychoTechFreak:
1. Don't get Hurt
2. Ram

hmm...
Wouldnt that contradict itself? Maybe cause the ship to jerk in one place and let the other ship kill it?

Phoenix-D · #3 February 25th, 2002, 06:32 AM

"Will this work the same way against a human opponent? I don't think so. Anyone know for sure?"

Won't STOP them, not if they're willing to take losses (and even a single minesweeper makes this idea worthless) but mines are nothing to sneeze at.

The only hitch I can see is if ships automaticlly stop after hitting mines. Even then, with only 5 mines you can't possibly cover every approach route.

Phoenix-D

Grandpa Kim · #4 February 25th, 2002, 07:45 AM

Regarding
1. Don't get hurt.
2. Ram.

quote:
Originally posted by TerranC:

hmm...
Wouldnt that contradict itself? Maybe cause the ship to jerk in one place and let the other ship kill it?

No contradiction to a computer. The two orders are mutually exclusive. Once the computer determines that the first won't work, it moves on to "Ram", completely forgeting about "Don't get hurt". If it survives, then on the next combat turn it starts over with "Don't get hurt" and the process repeats. At least that's the way it should work, in fact, that is pretty much the way it is described. The real problem is when does the computer determine that "Don't get hurt" isn't working?

Phoenix-D
I agree with you, but I haven't played enough PBW yet to be sure. For now I will operate on the premise that minefield will not stop a determined human opponent.

[ 25 February 2002: Message edited by: Grandpakim ]

PsychoTechFreak · #5 February 25th, 2002, 11:34 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Grandpakim:
Regarding
1. Don't get hurt.
2. Ram.

... The real problem is when does the computer determine that "Don't get hurt" isn't working?

In fact it doesn't work. My favorite Ram ship design (recently) is a ship full of organic armor 3 which is almost indestructable. It does not go over to ram strategy even when it is trapped in a corner.

But I have not found a strategy setting so far which rams colony ships or planets, both without weapons, no chance. Tried almost every possible targeting prio. My organic goat ship destroys every other ship (with weapons) though.

PvK · #6 February 26th, 2002, 12:42 AM

I meant PDC are weapons for purposes of AI maneuver. I am confident that I have seen PDC-only ships retreat while valid PDC targets were absent, and then advance as soon as valid PDC targets were launched by the enemy. You're right about them not being eligible for main weapon mounts.

PvK

quote:
Originally posted by dumbluck:
PvK:
Are you sure???? I thought it was a well established fact that PDC were not weapons. For instance, it explains why they aren't affected by the default weapons mounts. Other weapons get damage bonuses with the mounts, while PDC damage stays the same, and isn't even listed in the ship creation screen as being altered by the mount (while all the weapons get the little "L" in their picture for Large mount, etc.).

As to the shield depleters, I don't know. I've never used them.

[ 18 February 2002: Message edited by: dumbluck ]

dumbluck · #7 February 26th, 2002, 12:18 PM

quote:
Originally posted by PvK:
I meant PDC are weapons for purposes of AI maneuver. I am confident that I have seen PDC-only ships retreat while valid PDC targets were absent, and then advance as soon as valid PDC targets were launched by the enemy. You're right about them not being eligible for main weapon mounts.

PvK

You may be right about that. Without valid targets, the PD cruisers would default to "don't get hurt". I guess I never paid attention to whether they tried to come out of their corners for a turn whilst my front line ships got pounded by the missles that the PD cruisers were out of range of (because they ran for the corners).

And that is the crux of the problem. Unless your enemy has either fighters or some of the upper-upper-tier missle tech weapons, there aren't going to be any valid PDC targets on turn 1. Or turn 2, or 3, or 4, or 5, or 6. And by that time, your PD cruiser is hiding in a corner where it will do your front line ships absolutely no good.

I will have to test that in a game sometime. If I set the strategy for weaponless ships to hold formation, and the PD cruisers break formation anyway, we will know that PDC are considered weapons. If they hold formation, then they aren't weapons. The concensus of the forums till now has been that PDC aren't weapons, but you have brought up an interesting point.

[ 26 February 2002: Message edited by: dumbluck ]