US Income Tax - Unconstitutional

[capnq]

Atrocities said: watch the film and make your own opinion. don't just blow it off as bs.

A rant for a rant.

Unlike you, Atrocities, I do not surf the Web actively searching out stuff that will just depress me. I do not need to watch the film to form an opinion, because there isn't a word of it that I haven't heard before. Nothing yet mentioned in this thread is news to me. I'm not blowing it off because it's BS, I'm blowing it off because it's just more of the same.

Anyone who's worried about the national ID doesn't realize how much data is already out there. We are the most documented and dossiered culture in world history; one more number in the databases isn't going to change anything at this point.

Since I've already cut half of what I've typed, I'm going to quit now before I really cut loose and get in trouble with the moderators.

[Atrocities]

I am very happy for you in that you are happily putting that psychology degree to good work by psychoanalyzing me and asserting your opinion about my web surfing habits. Your check is in the mail.

I get that you don't care about the topic because you have heard it all before but please don't attack me because I posted the information. You never know, perhaps someone might come along who hasn't read this before and might find it an interesting topic.

[Gandalf Parker]

Everything has its pros and cons. Absolutes are the territory of fanatics so they are easily ignored.

I do not believe that taxes are wrong. Neither do I think that all of the present taxes have been done correctly. This is a subject that can stand scrutiny.

And I find it interesting, and worth watching, the views about the legality of what has happened.
Gandalf Parker

[Azselendor]

Government: The process of taking something simple and complicating it.

That's what happened to our tax system. Income tax is a good thing and it is legal - despite what evil boogie man conspiracies theories and tax protesters claim.

So we need to vote for smaller government -- and vote for candidates we can trust to do exactly that, if we can't find one we'll need to become one ourselves.

[Mindi]

My biggest complaint about our tax system is that double taxation is supposed to be illegal. But yet Richard and I have to pay tax to two cities because he works in one city and we live in another. Combined that with the fact that our city doesn't allow any exemptions and we pay more in local taxes than we do in state taxes. Gosh I can't wait until we're in a position to move.

[Atrocities]

Income tax is a good thing and it is legal - despite what evil boogie man conspiracies theories and tax protesters claim.

Yet the Supreme Court ruled that the 16th Amendment, the very amendment that the government says givens them the authority to institute an income tax, does not give the government the authority to enact new taxes.

All I am saying is this. Make it legal. If the government wants an income tax than fine, make it a law to shut up all the nae sayers. Then reform the IRS and the Tax Code. There is no excuse for someone making 60 million a year to pay less in taxes than someone making 25k working two jobs.

Mindi your situation must be extremely frustrating. Have people tried to change the law to help improve or at least reduce the double taxation?

[Mindi]

Nope, because the cities don't want to lose the tax, so they won't even work together to fix it. So we get taxed 2% for where Richard's full time job is (which is an hour commute each way btw) and 1.75% for where we live. Lancaster (where we live) does give you a credit for tax paid to other cities (even though they don't ever see that money as there is no cooperative agreement) but they only allow you to have a credit for a maximum of 1%. So we pay a total of 2.75% in local city taxes.

On top of which we now pay starting this year 1.5% school tax as the school system cooerced a tax that BARELY passed (and there is speculation about whether or not it really did pass, but I digress) by cutting off bussing to high schoolers and making the tax only on earned income, so anyone living on a pension, fixed income, investors, etc doesn't have to pay it. However that leaves those like Richard and I (no children, working hard and having to work outside of Lancaster as there are no IT jobs in little Lancaster, Ohio) paying the equivalent of 4.25% in LOCAL taxes and getting very little benefit as even if we had kids, I wouldn't send them to school here and the roads are always in need of repair. RIDICULOUS!

Okay that's my rant for the day, I just got done doing our taxes last week, so the wound is fresh! lol

Frankly, I am a big lover of a flat tax. It would get all that hidden under the table income and you can control how much you are paying in taxes. The more you spend the more you pay, it's that simple.

[Azselendor]

Atrocities, you forget the states and local governments can do pretty much whatever they want if the federal government hasn't claimed it.

The way it is phrased, the 16th amendment, when used under Article One of the United States Constitution at section eight or better known as the "Necessary-and-proper clause", clause 18 gives the government the power to tax any income as it would be an "Income Tax".

Now the states and local government under the 10th amendment pretty much have the right to abuse the people and tax them all they want -- which they routinely do. Down here in Orlando, we have several highways going in and out of town, but only one is toll free. That's the county nickel and dime'ing the locals. The city of orlando is constantly "tweaking" property appraisals which increase the taxation of property without a tax hike (ie, higher property values mean higher taxes). And the state of florida seems to be on the verge of dropping the low sales tax in favor of a steep services tax on small businesses and out of state distributors.

So really, is it the Income Tax being a burden or the States abusing their powers... again!

Mindi, your situation is insanity, hopefully you and richard both can get out of it or the situation changes soon.

[capnq]

Atrocities said: please don't attack me because I posted the information.

I apologize for snapping at you, but I was complaining about being accused of dismissing it as BS, not about you posting it.

I am too stressed out right now to pay any further attention to this thread.

[Atrocities]

I wish you well Capnq. Stress can be a killer.