OOB 30 Canada

[DRG]

At the time of release I had not heard anything official as to whether they will actually be named "C3" but it seems the logical choice .

Don

[Deadeye]

I think there is a couple more minor errors in the Canada OOB that I haven't seen mentioned anywhere (from the 3.5 CD version):

- 2 Light Trucks in the Misc area has three trucks defined not two.
- Inf Co-Det Wpns in the Infantry area appears to be missing a third AT unit for the third platoon.

Also, should there be an Inf Cbt Sup Co. formation?, since there is a Mech Cbt Sup Co. formation and for a few years span there is a Para Cbt Sup Co. formation.

Thanks,

Deadeye

[Mobhack]

Since the inf co support weapons platoon has two inf-ATW in it, where would a third come from in the company with these weapons detached down to the platoons?.

3 light trucks is an obvious typo - needs fixing.

Some OOB designers put in battalion support companies - others do not bother. I doubt I have bothered ever to buy one in all the years I have played, preferring to buy the detachments and cross-attaching to companies as needed instead.

Cheers
Andy

[Deadeye]

Mobhack said:
Since the inf co support weapons platoon has two inf-ATW in it, where would a third come from in the company with these weapons detached down to the platoons?.

Not being a military person at all & looking at other DW formations (such as the Inf Co DW/T) that do have 3 AT units - one per platoon, I made the assumption that the Inf Co Det Wpn should also have 3 AT Units - one per platoon.

Inf Co DW+ has 5 AT units.

So are you saying that the Inf Co Det Wpn Formation is correct and all the other DW formations are incorrect?

I'd just like it to be consistent one way or the other.

Deadeye

[Mobhack]

Canadian rifle coys had 2 MAWs and a 60mm mortar section at COy HQ weapons platoon, and an SFMG section which were sometimes detached down to the platoons.

Looking at the appropriate support weapons platoon in Mobhack, and extrapolate from there. And in so doing I think I see what has happened. Someone else has made a platoon with individual weapons added, but then made a coy with these platoons, 3 of each, making the count of coy support weapons wrong. That needs fixing. (Formation #30 is the one I did way back when and is correct, though someone has added a sniper in the meantime, to weapons platoons - that should be tacked on after the third platoon probably). Or - we could simply delete the "det weapons" company formations as surplus to requirements.

It'll be fixed for the next release.

Cheers
Andy

[DRG]

I'm looking into this and so far it's looking like everything is OK but I need to do further checks and will report back later

Don

[DRG]

Deadeye said:

Not being a military person at all & looking at other DW formations (such as the Inf Co DW/T) that do have 3 AT units - one per platoon, I made the assumption that the Inf Co Det Wpn should also have 3 AT Units - one per platoon.

Inf Co DW+ has 5 AT units.

So are you saying that the Inf Co Det Wpn Formation is correct and all the other DW formations are incorrect?

I'd just like it to be consistent one way or the other.

Deadeye

It is consistent. The answer is just hidden from view and is not immediately obvious

A standard Canadian infantry platoon ( formation 34 ) in this OOB
uses 1 hvy infantry squad and 3 infantry squads.

The Hvy infantry have the MG, the ATW and the 60mm mortar.

This gives a standard Canadian infantry platoon ( formation 34 )
access to .....

1 MG,
1 ATW
and 1 60mm Mortar.

But all bundled together.

The standard Infantry Co ( Formation 28 ) has three of those
infantry platoons ( and therefore 3 MG, 3 ATW and 3 60mm Mortars bundled
up ) PLUS the Inf Co Spt Pl ( formation 153 ) -- SFMG Section ( 2 MG's ) 1
60mm mortar section ( 2 tubes ), 2 Piat teams and one sniper ( I am
ignoring the sniper for this ) and therefore a total of

5 MG's
5 ATW
5 60mm mortars tubes total


The "Inf Co-det wpns" ( formation 30 ) has

1 Rifle Section- which is regular UC 1 infantry so no MMG or ATW or mortar integrated into it's structure
1 60mm Mortar Sec --which has two tubes
1 SFMG Section -- two GPMG's
1 infantry platoon--formation 34 ( see above, the "Hvy infantry" component
has 1 MG, 1 ATW , and 1 60mm Mortar )
1 If-AT team ( one ATW )
1 infantry platoon--formation 34 ( see above, the "Hvy infantry" component
has 1 MG, 1 ATW , and 1 60mm Mortar )
If-AT team ( one ATW )
1 infantry platoon--formation 34 ( see above, the "Hvy infantry" component
has1 MG, 1 ATW , and 1 60mm Mortar )

The grand total of "support weapons" for this formation is....

5 MG's
5 ATW
5 60mm mortars tubes total

So that all adds up to the total of support type weapons that formation 28 has.

The "Inf Pl Det Wpn" ( formation 313 ) has.......

3 regular UC 1 Infantry sections ( so no support weapons included ) and
1 GPMG
1 ATW
1 60mm Mortar

so that matches formation 34's support weapon count

The "Inf Co DW+" is built using formation 313 ( formation 334, it's the only one
that uses formation 313 ) and that formation uses...

1 rifle section which is regular UC 1 infantry so no MMG or ATW or mortar
3 of the Inf Pl Det Wpn platoons <<each>> of which has 3 regular UC 1
Infantry sections ++plus++ 1 GPMG and 1 ATW and 1 60mm Mortar

so we now have a subtotal of ..

3 MG's
3 ATW
3 60mm mortars tubes total

then Co Spt Pl (formation 153)is added in and that adds a SFMG
Section ( 2 MG's ) 1 60mm mortar section ( 2 tubes ), 2 Piat teams and one
sniper ( I am ignoring the sniper for this too ) and therefore a total of

5 MG's
5 ATW
5 60mm mortars tubes total

So it all adds up to the same number of
support weapons for all three formations

Formation 28 -Infantry Co ( Formation 28 )
equals
Formation 30 - Inf Co-det wpns
which also equals
Formation 334 - Inf Co DW+

for the overall count of MG's ATW and 60mm mortars

Don

[DRG]

One thing that throws a bit curve into everything is

Inf Co DW/T+ (formation 329)

and

Inf Co DW/T (formation 330)

should really be named

Inf Co DW/T (formation 329)

and

Inf Co DW/T(-) (formation 330)

to match the original formations that do not have added support weapons ( like formation 29-Infantry Co (-) or formation 25 Mech Inf Co (-))

and, as well there are slight problem with formation 337 and 338 that I will attend to for the next patch

Don

[Deadeye]

Wow what a set of detailed answers - took me awhile to work through it all.

It makes sense now that you've explained it. Thanks!

If the DW formations are authentic then I'd rather they be kept around for the extra flexibility in buying options.

On the Blitz forum there is some discussion of experimental rules that would only allow the purchase of pre-defined formations (except for the leftover points at the end). This is why I asked about the Inf Cbt Sup Co. formation in my earlier post.

The experimental rules discussion is at Blitz Forums

Deadeye