OT- Argentina, what a country!

[Andrés]

I'd like to be able to tell you we're better now, but it looks like things are about to explode again soon.
I think that the main problem is that nothing has happened.
Recession has been only worsening during all this time.
The government keeps announcing new economic plans every week what only increases incertitude.
The only thing that Duhalde did shortly after assuming as president was devaluate.
We now know that one of our problems was that our currency was overvalued, devaluation could have been good, if it was a part of a plan. Instead all it did is trigger our old friend the inflation. The only thing holding off hyperinflation (like we had in the early 90s) is the recession.
The bank "corralito" is still up. Now they came up with a "tapón" law to prevent people from getting their savings with a judicial order.

Last week they wanted to cover bank debts with state emitted "bonex", what means again the state covering debts of power friend's private companies and stealing our savings to pay.
Now it seems that each bank will emit its own "bono", so we'll have hundreds of useless papers going around.
They told us to trust banks and to trust our money like people from most other countries do. Now we're paying the price for believing them. Our experience has tough us once more than the only safe way to keep your savings it to buy dollars and hide them at home.

It seems that the only ideas were to put exigencies from the IMF, and how to increase their fund-raising for the state (mostly by increasing taxes) and not how to reactivate internal economy.

[ 29 April 2002: Message edited by: Andrés Lescano ]

[Karel]

The situation you describe and what I read in the newspapers here in Holland sounds very bad. This is not a temporary crisis, the economic system is bankrupt.

To fix the economic system of Argentina will take a long time and a lot of offers. As a matter of principle the idea of temporary fixing bankaccounts is not bad, it will give time for the banksystem to recover (with help from the international community?). If the banksystem collapses, than Argentina will face an even worser breakdown. BUT foreign banks have foreign reserves for their liabilities.

One big word of optimism: the people of Argentina is united against the problems and does everything in there power to overcome them.

respeto!!!!!

I have seen it different in Africa, where the people take their situation for granted and don't show the stamina of your people.

[TheGunslinger]

One solution, or at least help would be to send people from the financial elite from other countries like lets say Germany, England, France over to Argentinia, they could help establishing a new economical system.

Anyway sorry for the grammar and typos, this was really hard to write for me

[TerranC]

quote:

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Originally posted by TheGunslinger:
One solution, or at least help would be to send people from the financial elite from other countries like lets say Germany, England, France over to Argentinia, they could help establishing a new economical system.

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I think that was done already.

If you ask me, the Argentine economy is bound to start up again, even if it takes the Argentine government to cut back major stuff.

Economic Miracles can happen if the country is united; happened in Korea, Germany, Taiwan, and Japan.

Just My two cents.

[Andrés]

This has been discussed a lot, I agree, most private banks here are foreign, and should be able to respond with their home-country reserves.
Politicians are again helping state banks that wouldn’t be available to do this, and as always helping their friends to do great business.
Another interesting fact is that the economic problems of banks are because they were forced to lend money to the state.

The state (national state and provinces) has been funding itself in constant indebtedness, if that makes sense, for the Last 10 years.
One of the banks that is in worst problems is the "Banco Provincia de Buenos Aires". What a coincidence that Duhalde has been governor of that province during that time.
Until Devember, when banks were so impoverished that could take it no more, and Cavallo had to create the corralito, they’ve been working to hide their own mistakes and not looking for a solution.
We cannot trust the same corrupts who created the problem in first place to solve it now.

Not only the financial system is bankrupt, the whole political system is collapsing.
The most believable and serious of the many new movements we’re seeing now concentrate on how to create a new political class in which people can believe and trust, and not on how to solve the economic problem that is but a consequence of the corrupt political system.
There’s been much talk lately about the re-foundation of the republic.

[Cylapse]

You know, as someone in Phoenix, AZ... I would not have thought that this would affect me. Hell, honestly, I had to figure out WHERE Argentina was (ditched history in school, so incidentally geography went with it)

...Anyway, this enrages me deeply, and forced me to consider how things are over here as well... There is a bigger fake-smile on things and, of course, the economy has some stability (some *lol*)... but Banks arent much different. Its funny, I think someone at my bank, for example, waits and watches until my account gets to a lower amount, and then -and only then- do they post those "delayed" transactions... *LOL* They robbed my *** blind, pulled me into a negative and cleared my savings account as an act of "overdraft protection"... bull**** *lol* Thieves.

Anyway, I feel for your cause, and have been watching this thread... I know I cant really do anything, but Im glad you and your people there have the balls, initiative, and drive to accomplish as much as you have. I mean ****, 5 presidents in 12 days? Did I read that right? Obviously... the people as a whole are a force to be reckoned with.

And hell - if non-violent actions cannot solve the problem... if worse comes to worse... revenge can feel good with homemade explosives... Not to be the voice of evil, violence or terrorism... But from I've read here, and heard elsewhere - **** the Argentina Government. Would feel no sympathy if mysterious fires erupted and took down some of those offices. Should things turn too far - its either time to go, or time to take the country back.

[Wardad]

I feel for you and Argentina. You will be in my prayers.

May your good capable people be ALLOWED to succeed.
May their heirs be ALLOWED to fail.


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God Bless

[wr8th]

Andres,

Buena suerte para Ud. y su familia!

I was thinking about you a couple weeks back as I was downloading some of your shipsets and read your address as being from Argentina.

The things we take for granted... like having a good sense of what tomoroow will likely bring and it isn't anarchy, is something to be thankful for.

Best wishes.

[Karel]

sorry, no economic wonder.

Economic Wonders don't happen. There are things we can't explain, but a wonder, no. Very simple: an economy needs some basic terms, for example good (tax)laws, healty finacial system (e.g. trustworthy(to exclude Andersen) accountants, banks, analyst, press, ect), less corruption, stabile government, etc.

sorry Andres, but like you know, Argentina violates some of these basic terms and to fix them will take a lot of time even with a 'honest' government, I mean a government who forces banks to give them loans???? Unbelievable.

Here in Holland the reaction from Dutch multinationals to the Argentina crisis is withdrawing or freezing of operations in Argentina. To get their trust and money back will take a long time.

[jimbob]

Andres,

I'm really sorry to hear how badly things are (continuing) to go in Argentina . It's an incredible shame that the people entrusted to run the country for the people systematically robbed them.

The worst part is, these corrupt individuals probably are incapable of having shame... they had to be forced from office, not having the morality to see their unmatched ambition and corruption!

I wish you the best, you and your country. May God have mercy on the humble, and may He crush the proud under His feet (what other hope can there be?).

-jimbob