Is magic worth it?!?

Warhammer · #1 June 14th, 2007, 11:00 AM

Wrath of God is an awfully nice Astral spell that kills your opponent's troops. Playing single player right now and 300 troops are wounded and 100+ are killed every turn with me doing nothing.

SlipperyJim · #2 June 14th, 2007, 12:27 PM

Short Answer: Yes, magic is certainly worth it.

Remember that magic is about more than simply tossing battlefield nukes. As others have written, Astral magic is really more for support than for blasting.

Here are several non-battlefield uses of Astral magic:

quick transportation -> Teleport, Gateway, Astral Travel
reconnaissance -> Astral Window, Eyes of God
site-searching -> Acashic Record
commander-killing -> Mind Hunt
defense -> Dispel, Dome of Arcane Warding
dominion-pushing -> Telestic Animates, Juggernauts
WISH ('nuff said)

Astral magic also offers some nice Construction possibilities: Pendants of Luck, Amulets of Antimagic, Rings of Sorcery and Wizardry (to boost other paths), Spell Foci, Robes of Shadows, and that Shroud thingy to bless your non-sacred commanders.

However, Astral magic can also be handy on the battlefield. Besides the tactics that have already been mentioned, here are a few more:

Stellar Cascades -> No, it's not as impressive as the Abysian BBQ, but it can be just as effective. Dish out massive AP stun damage to large numbers of badguys. Then your troops can kill them easier....
Star Fires -> Cheap, simple ... armor-negating damage. Great for opponents with a lot of protection and not many HP.
Solar Rays -> Reasonably effective anti-undead spell. Kill hordes of zombies.

I can also attest to the effectiveness of the previously-mentioned Mind Burn and/or Soul Slay. Sure, each spell only kills one unit, but that's great against an opponent with expensive, hard-to-kill units. Set up a row of Mystics with Spell Foci (to increase magical penetration) and start zapping.

Ironhawk · #3 June 14th, 2007, 02:07 PM

If you are playing the AI and want to see the power of magic, you shouldn't be using Astral. Try the elemental magics. The most obvious example is using a strong Earth nation in EA and casting Blade Winds. Just try it and see - it will open up your eyes to the power of battlefield magic.

Then, when you are ready to take it up a notch, play a nation with strong Fire and cast Firestorm or Flames from the Sky (the really high level one) in midsummer.

General_Jah · #4 June 14th, 2007, 05:28 PM

So if I am understanding some of you right... LA magic has less of an impact on the game... In your opinions does minimizing this huge dynamic of the game (magic) in the LA and to lesser extent MA, make the game less strategically complex? If I am wanting a more strategically complex game do you recommend sticking with EA?

What are most MP games played with?

Any recommendations for a good SP experience?

thanks!

Jazzepi · #5 June 14th, 2007, 05:30 PM

The only difference I've noticed of magic in the game is that EA, by default, has a higher random magic site level.

I guess the nations are suppose to have less access to good mages, as well.

Jazzepi

Shovah32 · #6 June 14th, 2007, 05:48 PM

Magic has a strong impact in every age. Certainly there are some very strongly magical early nations(abysia gets F4+randoms on a mage, caelum A4+randoms ect) but LA has some decent mages too(check out patala) and in any game lasting a long time magic will probably be the main factor. As gandalf said small maps, weak independents(7-9 is most common) and many opponents all lessen the effects of magic and limit the time and resources avaliable to develop your magic.

Play a single player game with the minimum reccomended ai players, indies set to 8 and other settings on normal and you should get to use some magic.

LA Arco isnt really a good choice for seeing the powers of battle-field magic when your just starting. Astral is mainly single target up until the end game and nature isnt really a combat path either. Try the game setting i reccomended with EA Abysia and hire a bunch of mages(trying to get atleast a few annointed of rhuax for later) to quickly research evocation(up to atleast falling fires). You national troops are fire-immune so they wont take damage from your fireballs and falling fires which should decimate the enemy.

General_Jah · #7 June 14th, 2007, 05:52 PM

Quote:

Shovah32 said:
Magic has a strong impact in every age. Certainly there are some very strongly magical early nations(abysia gets F4+randoms on a mage, caelum A4+randoms ect) but LA has some decent mages too(check out patala) and in any game lasting a long time magic will probably be the main factor. As gandalf said small maps, weak independents(7-9 is most common) and many opponents all lessen the effects of magic and limit the time and resources avaliable to develop your magic.

Play a single player game with the minimum reccomended ai players, indies set to 8 and other settings on normal and you should get to use some magic.

LA Arco isnt really a good choice for seeing the powers of battle-field magic when your just starting. Astral is mainly single target up until the end game and nature isnt really a combat path either. Try the game setting i reccomended with EA Abysia and hire a bunch of mages(trying to get atleast a few annointed of rhuax for later) to quickly research evocation(up to atleast falling fires). You national troops are fire-immune so they wont take damage from your fireballs and falling fires which should decimate the enemy.

thanks i will try that!

MaxWilson · #8 July 3rd, 2007, 01:18 AM

Quote:

Shovah32 said:
LA Arco isnt really a good choice for seeing the powers of battle-field magic when your just starting. Astral is mainly single target up until the end game and nature isnt really a combat path either. Try the game setting i reccomended with EA Abysia and hire a bunch of mages(trying to get atleast a few annointed of rhuax for later) to quickly research evocation(up to atleast falling fires). You national troops are fire-immune so they wont take damage from your fireballs and falling fires which should decimate the enemy.

I thought Arco had access to mystics in all ages. If so, you've got great battle magic because all mystics have access to Communion at Thau-1, and with the great variety of elemental magics mystics have you should be able to cast most of the good battle spells up to E3/W3/F3 or so, depending upon which mystic you pick to be the Communion master.

-Max

-Max

Ironhawk · #9 June 14th, 2007, 05:50 PM

Yeah, i think that is a valid statement. Magic has less impact in LA cause your mages arent as powerful / dont have as good randoms. But I think the extent of the impact is highly debatable.

If you are looking to maximize the dynamism of a game you should play EA. There will be, on average, more summoned units, more interesting battlefield spells, and more globals due to the prevalance of magic.

Forrest · #10 June 15th, 2007, 12:25 AM

If you can't stand to piecemeal it then Mass protection is for you. Suddenly those lizards that C'tiss puts out become hard to kill. Don't forget your healing light or Skull staffs.

My personal favorites Flaming arrows and rain, depending on which side I am on.

Desiccation or Curse of the desert seems petty but I have seen it rout mean armies. Your troops just grind to a halt.

Got water? Bottles of living water are great. One water elemental is pathetic. Five or ten is something else. That wimpy scout is a one shot SC. Put him in the front with a say behind troops order and he is a fire and forget weapon.