'Heim nerf mod?

[Kristoffer O]

You could mix in a heat aura to mitigate some of the worst chill

[Meglobob]

You know what the best nerf would be for the heims?

Give the new players or players who often get knocked out early 1st option on them when setting up a MP game.

This would also mean new players would be less likely to get knocked out early and have a better game. Thus more likely to play MP more in the future.

I think EA Vanheim, MA Vanheim, EA Helheim, EA Niefelheim and LA Ermor should all be offered to new players 1st.

[thejeff]

That's not a bad policy, but it sort of falls in the same category as banning them. It's a workaround, though one with the benefit of helping the new players.

I'd still like to see a balanced mod if possible. What was done to them in CB? May not really apply since so much else was changed, but...

Thing is, I like those nations. Van/Helheim particularly. I like the feel, I like the flavor. I like the magic they get, etc, etc. I even like the brutal cavalry. I'd like to see the sacreds nerfed enough that they're not the only effective choice. I like the EA all glamor troops idea and I'll play with that in SP. Later on the berserkers and skinshifters are very cool troops that rarely get used because it's easier and more effective to just build more blessed Vans.

I'm not sure what needs to change, but I'd love to see it done.

And I'm still puzzled that EA Vanheim makes the list and LA Vanheim doesn't. I would have guessed that EA was the weakest, at least for a bless strategy.

[quantum_mechani]

thejeff said:

I'd still like to see a balanced mod if possible. What was done to them in CB? May not really apply since so much else was changed, but...

Nerfs specifically to those nations in CB:

*Van sacred cavalry and Helhirdlings cost 90 gold
*Jotun Skinshifters cost 90 gold

That may not look like much, but keep in mind that in CB high (double 9s and higher) blesses are much costlier. If someone wants to abuse sacred troops to the max, the hits to the scales will make pumping those sacreds quite a bit more difficult, not to mention keeping up in the magic game. On the other side of the coin, nations without a huge bless get that much more out of their scales to help combat a bless rush.

And I'm still puzzled that EA Vanheim makes the list and LA Vanheim doesn't. I would have guessed that EA was the weakest, at least for a bless strategy.

I very much agree, I might call EA Vanhiem the weakest Van era, especially considering the power of the other EA nations. I'd also say Lanka is missing on that list.

I really recommend people finding bless abuse sucking the fun out of the game give CB a try. If you are daunted by the number of changes/size of the readmes and summary of the complete version, the Pretenders and Scales segment's changes are readily apparent by browsing pretender creation and help diversify the viable choices quite a bit.

[Shovah32]

I would probably agree that EA Vanheim is the weakest Van era. Mainly because MA and LA have skinshifters(very, very nasty) and stronger sacreds although i might rate LA lower than EA depending on the situation.

[Saint_Dude]

It seems that we already have a mod that addresses many of the imbalances of sacred units; namely CB.

If you nerf the stats of many of these units, they cease to be interesting. CB nerfs them by increasing their gold cost, and increasing the point cost of high blesses (which are used to make certain sacreds particularly irksome). Seems reasonable to me.

[thejeff]

But it does many other things as well. I would prefer a more focused change.

I'm not at all sure that all high bless strategies need to be made more costly. I think the problems are more narrow.

Obviously a total nerf to the stats makes them not useful, but there should be a point at which they're still good, but don't dominate.