Dark Knight

Sensori · #1 October 2nd, 2007, 12:10 AM

Quote:

Ironhawk said:

Well, its been around since the Dom2 days and the devs are aware of it... but still no changes to how it works in all that time.

So what does that mean?

It means that it's a mechanic from the times of Dominions *1* that just hasn't been changed for one reason or another. Probably due to the priorization thing people have been talking about.

Personally, I think that abusing it is lame and completely out of the realm of D3. It's an ancient thing from the olden days when it was the norm which should've been removed ages ago, but hasn't been. This sort of reminds me of bugs (even exploits) for which people have been banned for that have been in Anarchy Online from nearly the start and are only now being fixed (after 6 years of the game being in existence). The major difference between Dominions and AO in this field however is that FunCom has a lot more people working on their game.

Yeah. It's a relic from a time when you could make limitless amounts of elemental kings and queens (sort of like Tartarians of those days, except you could make craploads of actually good freespawn stuff too), devils of all sorts, gem hoarding items were cheap, wishing for Doom Horrors and having armies of them was possible and when Arcane Nexus was truly awesome (those two were prolly in D2 still, though)... Ahh, those were the days.

/ramble

Aezeal · #2 October 2nd, 2007, 04:02 AM

It's explotation of a but IMHO and in most games/settings/MPthingies that is not the same a cheating but it usually IS punished the same as cheating and frowned upon nearly as much.

Having said that I think one should not use it in MP games

Edratman · #3 October 2nd, 2007, 08:59 AM

I agree wholeheartedly with Aezeal.

It is an exploitation, not cheating. It is an action that is attainable within the game programming and not an external influence or prohibited by any rule other than consensus opinion. And since it is a known carryover from root/parent programing, it is difficult to consider it a bug, maybe a flaw in the programming, but not a bug.

As I read the thread, this exploitation apparently would only be known to Dom1/Dom2 veterans, and probably just a portion of them. It sounds devestating, but extremely unlikely and very difficult to achieve. It is available to only a few nations or specific pretender builds, but what powerful effect isn't.

Just my opinion.

Kristoffer O · #4 October 2nd, 2007, 11:59 AM

I like the fact that the VIsitors, Bogus and his merry men, have the ability to target commanders.

I think it can be fun in an SP game to get hold of these ancient tactical skills. The older the better (in accordance with the creed of most new religious movements). These are dom-ppp survivals and ancient to boot.

I think it would be naughty to use these orders in MP, unless all players agreed to their eventual use.

I think it would be fun if assassins were given limited access to these orders.

Burnsaber · #5 October 2nd, 2007, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Kristoffer O said:
I think it would be fun if assassins were given limited access to these orders.

Yeah, if it were made so that you can't copy orders into a unit unless he is actually allowed to do them (this would also stop yuo from accidentally scripting fire spells on a water mage.. etc), that would be extremely cool.

You know all those leadership 80-120 national commanders who really can't do anything that indie commanders couldn't do for cheaper (ferrying troops)? They're supposed to do be "tactical geniuses extraordinaire". Why not allow them to see with their tactical genius who are the opposing commanders/mages and challenge them in the battlefield?

Kristoffer O · #6 October 2nd, 2007, 01:51 PM

We have speculated on the reverse. Disallowing some orders on lousy commanders, but that was a while ago, and will probably not appear in the forseeable future.

Edratman · #7 October 2nd, 2007, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Kristoffer O said:
We have speculated on the reverse. Disallowing some orders on lousy commanders, but that was a while ago, and will probably not appear in the forseeable future.

Sorry KO, but I cannot fathom the logic or reasoning behind the disallowing some orders on lousy commanders.

Velusion · #8 October 2nd, 2007, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Kristoffer O said:
I think it would be naughty to use these orders in MP, unless all players agreed to their eventual use.

Thats good enough for me to ban the practice on games that I host.

Aezeal · #9 October 2nd, 2007, 03:43 PM

and right you are

I guess you only mean the copying though.. using it with units that actually have the order themselves isn't morally wrong I think (and seems to be the general consensus)

Ironhawk · #10 October 2nd, 2007, 03:53 PM

You know, I was begining to support the "dont use Bogus orders" camp... But then I thought back to QM's point about archer decoying and there are some disturbing parallels. People are arguing here that you shouldnt use the Bogus commands because it was the intent of the devs to remove them from the game.

But clearly the devs did not remove those commands. And then you take the concept of archer decoying. The devs clearly tried to remove this tactic from the game by crippling the morale of small squads. But yet the tactic persists and no one really gripes about how it is an exploit of the archer targeting AI. How can you explain the imbalance? Will people start playing games with decoying banned?