Mongoose - Starting (at last!)

[Sensori]

No, there's not an agreement on anything. I'm just playing my nation in a roleplay sense (devious Illithid and all that) and such and such. If you want explanations, Abysia also broke against a non-aggression pact when he went for Ulm when Ulm attacked me, which made it easier for me to go against NAPs when he came under attack. And I was seriously afraid that you guys would actually destroy Abysia in a quick, swift stroke, just like you did with Ermor. I was taken by total surprise when the armies started falling like flies.

Turned out I had completely overestimated your combined armies.

As for the NAPs, I made sure that I didn't invade your lands, kill your men and children and rape your women, because they were in effect. I have only helped Abysia to repel you from his lands so far. This, as far as I know, is fairly common in Dominions games - helping allies (and others in dire need of help) indirectly when they are at war and you are not. Some prefer a more direct approach, attacking people left and right, some like to attack from the shadows and use attacks that may or may not bite you in the *** if you over do it. Some even let others pay them to use remote attacks against another nation.

And I'm ready to come up and say that I overdid it, but hey, it did the job it was supposed to do.

Abysia was OK with the NAP. He however wasn't OK with the fact that you attacked him unannounced (a fairly common thing that happens in Dominions games when no deals are up. Never liked it however). I was under the impression that he had NAPs with you all (except Caelum). When I started wondering about the Marignonian and Arcoscephalean armies on mine and his borders, it turned out his NAPs had expired. He of course expected me to help him right then and there, and having learned from the experience with Ermor ("he might not be around in four to five turns"), that's what I opted to do.

And don't take things said too seriously - you're playing just fine. And I don't think this war is anywhere near its end. There are no "universally agreed" things in the Dominions community that I have heard of. Breaking NAPs is a bad thing, however. Seriously enough about this particular situation, it had all the signs of a quick gang up (*three* nations attacking one at once?) that I had no idea what else I should do, especially with my predisposition to hate unannounced attacks - it seemed like a do or die situation.

Which it wasn't. I overestimate and worry about things too much for my own good. And now I keep explaining and explaining, which is another less than admirable trait I happen to have. ;p

--

EDIT talk: I started thinking. There's more that needs to be said.

In case someone is wondering, the post I made to Loren was in character. That means basically that, when I called people cowardly, out in the open, for something people do often enough (no matter how much I don't like it), it's actually an attempt to make the fact that hell, I just got caught breaking against the spirit of NAP all over the place, look a bit better. It's just In Character talk, nothing more, nothing less. If my BS offends someone, I'm sorry. And I'm sorry for confusing folks with that randomness and throwing around insults which may have been taken personally when none such was meant.

Of course R'lyeh (and its leaders) will think that they will win. To be frank, I have no idea who will win. I personally have no desire to win. For various reasons. But by helping Abysia and making the game possibly more fun for its player, as I realized, I made the game less fun for three other people by using mind hunt... That isn't such a good method of learning now is it. I'm sorry for doing it, but I've managed to drive myself into a damn corner now.

But Caelum has to have some tricks up his sleeve, right? Right? Those Caelian Seraphs weren't it, were they?

And Eldanesh. Whatever I say in our "heated" exchange about peace/no peace, it has always been in character BS. Sure, I may find the stuff you're doing stupid, but seriously... It's not that bad when you consider the situation (I was about as large as you for starters, and then I had five land provinces right next to you). Please keep that in mind when you read them - I'm talking there as the leadership of R'lyeh to the leadership of Ulm, not as me to you. And if I've managed to offend you, I'm really sorry.

I'll never understand why you demanded me to give you the provinces for nothing, though. Was it a miscommunication or what?

Maybe I should give up R'lyeh to someone else, I'm starting to feel I'm doing more damage to the game than good. :|

[WonderLlama]

Don't worry about offending me. You certainly didn't say anything near as bad as Ermor did. I thought you were saying that what I did was legitimately not ok. Role playing makes learning the game and learning the rules of diplomacy a lot more confusing.

Mind hunt I understand and am ok with. I understand the theory of how to counter it. I just wasn't expecting to have to deal with it at the moment. And I sort of thought the newbie game rules meant treaties were more likely to be followed. But I understand what to expect from it, so I'm not panicking over it.

Blood magic is a different story; I have no idea what to expect from it. All I know is that people say it gets crazy powerful late game, and you have to deal with it early. And that it just dealt with two allies with ease.

Now back in the game, I am of course upset about the NAP. I'm also interested that my allies had an NAP that I didn't know about. I definitely still have tricks up my sleeves. Those seraphs were just a very expensive experiment. The trouble is, I've just seen two allies wounded extremely badly, and I haven't even seen the force that did it yet. If I can't even protect my allies, then what good am I? I am having an existential crisis.

[fabio80mi]

Greetings!
This is the player behind abysia speaking so no roleplaying involved.

What you did can be called cowardice especially if coming from the self-declared 'forces of good' but it was COMPLETELY a legit tactic both as a roleplay thing (abysia is, in fact , an evil nation:P) and as a diplomatic thing (you formed an alliance and attacked a nation your percieved as a threat).
So absolutely no whinings or ill-feeling on my part it's just the way the game plays :-)

However you couldn't expect me to go down without a fight and making you pay DEARLY for your invasion right??

Snd so now you have a fight! You may very well likely win (even with r'ylen defensive support) but who knows at least we'll have some fun :-)

As to explain r'yleh help well i actually expected it because of a precedent.
I was in very very good term with Ulm and r'yleh and tried hard for many turns to make them like each other and bring them together in a war front.
In the end, for a mistake i think, ulm invaded r'yleh so i could standby and do nothing (possibly losing 2 friends and being completely surrended by a very large and powerful nation) or pick one... i picked the one in my view was the invaded one and stook with him in the war.

Unfortunatly your 'alliance' had good intelligence and decided to attack me when most of my forces were away so now i can't committ with Ulm! i also tried to convince Ulm (and r'yleh both) to make peace well it didn't work :-)

Now i'm in a very interesting fight with 2 land nation attacking me in the west, your seraph in my backyard and ulm on the north.. interesting isn't it?

P.S.
Edit for blood magic-> it is of course a very good school of magic BUT though being powerful (ask marignon and arco:P) it's not invincible.
This is my first game playing medium abysia (even on sp..) and first mp game so i'm a very far away to master it.. guess i'll learn along the way as we are all doing !

[Sensori]

For what it's worth, the Starspawn of R'lyeh now notify the three allied Western nations (Arcoscephale, Caelum, Marignon) of the beginning of the formal cancellation of the various non-aggression pacts.

While it may be a pointless gesture, consider us at total war in four months (five as the case may be with one).

[Eldanesh]

I'm aware these things were out of character. Considering I'm playing Ulm with 3 drain U'd think I'd be trying to be dense and honest.

[Sensori]

You mean the things were "in character", on both sides, right? Out of character means that we would've been going on at each other on a personal level rather than as leaders of nashuns that are at odds. And you DO have an excellent point there! I never thought of it that way (the drain and denseness thing). It's kinda funny how I *constantly* use IC (short for in character lawl) rhetoric and then fail to realize when others do the same sometimes. Pretty fun way to play 'em, I must say. Well, not so fun for ME when the things started happening, because it lead to a heap of trouble and some frustration, but in retrospect, it's been a fun lil "debate".

[Loren]

Sensori said:
No, there's not an agreement on anything. I'm just playing my nation in a roleplay sense (devious Illithid and all that) and such and such. If you want explanations, Abysia also broke against a non-aggression pact when he went for Ulm when Ulm attacked me, which made it easier for me to go against NAPs when he came under attack. And I was seriously afraid that you guys would actually destroy Abysia in a quick, swift stroke, just like you did with Ermor. I was taken by total surprise when the armies started falling like flies.

The reason our armies fell like flies is the same reason you'll die to him also--summoned devils.

Remember that he's sitting there blood hunting and forging soul contracts. Each soul contract yields 1 devil/turn until the mage dies. Remember, also, that since they are not recruitable they have no price--and thus no upkeep. We knew the danger, we just didn't realize it was already too late.

[Sensori]

Hey Llamabeast, what's up with the game status page?

Invalid nation name! Waiting for 2h file
Invalid nation name! Waiting for 2h file
Invalid nation name! Waiting for 2h file
Invalid nation name! Waiting for 2h file
Invalid nation name! Waiting for 2h file


wat

[llamabeast]

Er, good question. Will investigate...

[Sensori]

Edited for the fact that now it's showing everything just right. ;p No turn received, though.

Thanksjoo, Llama!