Productive Scale needs some Enhancements

Reverend Zombie · #1 December 3rd, 2007, 05:30 PM

What if the pretender-point cost for prod/sloth were decreased, and its benefits kept the same?

zlefin · #2 December 3rd, 2007, 06:59 PM

how about having some magic sites that allow recruitment of units made entirely out of resources? some sort of mechanical constructs or so. that way gold as a limiting factor wouldn't be an issue. pure upside for having production scales. at least if you find one of the sites.

what about putting in siege weapons to the game? like catapults and stuff, with very heavy resource costs.
just soem more ideas.

DrPraetorious · #3 December 3rd, 2007, 07:28 PM

I've got a mod nation that has both of those things - it's late age Carthacia.

There are already a few specific nations that want productivity - LA Man, for exmaple, cares a *lot* - but that doesn't address the broader issue of not enough people taking Productivity-3.

People taking Sloth-3 a lot doesn't actually bother me, by the way - it's the lack of interest in Prod-3 outside of a few specialized nations that concerns me.

Sir_Dr_D · #4 December 3rd, 2007, 09:02 PM

I agree that the construction time/cost of forts should be affected by the production scale.

I also think that growth/death should effect maintaince cost of troops. So with growth you can more easily afford larger armies.

The magic scale needs a boost as well. Right now in the long run you get more magic research from creating another fort and lab from your order income, then if you took turmoil/magic. If magic did something else like effect your gem income (silghtly), effect the cost of labs, or increased the chances of a recruitable mage getting a random path, it would make things more interesting.

With changes like the above it would no longer be a no brainer to take order 3 every time.

KissBlade · #5 December 4th, 2007, 12:05 AM

I have to agree that in base game, sloth 3 is auto for me. When cb bumped it to 15% it made me more wary of it but base, I just look for a forest/mountain neighbor. Oh no.

Micah · #6 December 4th, 2007, 01:38 AM

How about bumping the gold modifier to 4% instead of the current 2? That would certainly increase the effect of the scale, as sloth-3 it would offset nearly 2 points of order instead of just one. Might sting enough to make it less of an auto-pick, and would help out nations that do take production, which are generally somewhat hindered due to the points they have to spend on it instead of a bless/SC.

Folket · #7 December 4th, 2007, 03:35 AM

I like prod 3. I use it in several games and it works fine. I think it nice to have in a endgame as well as I can recruit my armies where I want them and do not have to waste time shuttling armies around.

K · #8 December 4th, 2007, 04:44 AM

Quote:

Sir_Dr_D said:
The magic scale needs a boost as well. Right now in the long run you get more magic research from creating another fort and lab from your order income, then if you took turmoil/magic. If magic did something else like effect your gem income (silghtly), effect the cost of labs, or increased the chances of a recruitable mage getting a random path, it would make things more interesting.

Magic scales does effect gem income. Random events that give you gems happen far more frequently in a Magic dominion, and there is an event where you lose gems that only occurs in a Drain dominion ("Magic is fading and some of your gems have lost power", or something like that).

Twan · #9 December 4th, 2007, 10:01 AM

I don't think magic or growth need a boost. For many nations magic 3 changes the main researcher type (allow to use a very cost effective mages instead of expensive combat ones for research and stay in the race for uniques items/summons ; and you gain lots of gold with the smaller cost/upkeep). And growth is teh endgame scale (of course less usefull in games of short duration but the best to have if you plan to play 60 or more turns).

Also the two have synergic effects not only with order (more mages or more income/pop) but with luck (awesome events adding pop or regular income with growth ; luck 3 growth 3 even with turmoil 3 beats order 3 by far in the long run).

mathusalem · #10 December 4th, 2007, 10:06 AM

I disagree with you Twan, when you said "luck 3 growth 3 even with turmoil 3 beats order 3 by far in the long run".

It's depend first of the map's size : luck is more useful in little map, but the game will be shorter.

And *if* you are right and the combo T3G3L3 beats O3, you have paid 3 scales more for what ? a probability. I prefer certitude