Devnull Mod Gold Version 1.60

[ColdSteel]

Hi, I wanted to report a problem that I saw with the new Monsters race in DevNullGold160. It seems to be missing some of the graphics files for the raceset. This causes some problems with some of the race viewer utilties out there (like mine). It works but leaves an real ugly hole in the HTML.

I understand this is probably still a work in progress. One suggestion to prevent problems would be just to use placeholder graphics and then as you get the missing ones completed you can add them in 1 by 1.

Thanks,

-CS

[Urendi Maleldil]

Now that you have monsters, (a really awesome thing by the way) how about adding a "monster hunters" race that behave in the same way as the monsters (don't colonize), but are specifically designed to take out space monsters.

That could lead to some interesting battles where your race is caught in the middle of a huge war between monsters and hunters.

[Rollo]

Dogscoff - Uh oh, space worms... Did you manage to kill one, yet?
In my current game I had the greatest difficulties with the monsters. They started rather close to me, opened warp points everywhere, glassed many colonies and "ate" one homeworld. I was so busy with defending that I totally missed that the other AIs were building huge empires. I had good relations with all of them and the trade kept me alive pretty well. By turn 190 the Vikings had a score of 3.5M and declared war on me. The worst part was the loss of trade and the Vikings were hitting me heavily with intel. Shortly after that I lost all other trade, because of communication mimics and was at war with everybody. Also I lost another homeworld due to PPP. I glassed all nearby Viking colonies and the resulting riots took a heavy toll on their score (down to 1.7M). They lost most of their intel points and now I can defend against them. Still the monsters are very dangerous. Lost a fleet some turns ago that was hit by 96 drones .
Glad that you like the mod so far, let me know how you do in your game. Do you find the monsters too tough / too easy to beat? I guess it depends largely on how close you start to them, but I am considering toning them down a bit (apart from fleshing them out, of course). Is that appropriate or am I just a whimp?

Cold Steel - Actually none of the graphics for the monsters are missing, everything needed for them is there . But I know what you mean and you are right this is a work still in progress. I should point out that the monsters are not supposed to be a regular shipset and I just included the gfx that they actually use in order to keep the mod as small as possible. I am somewhat reluctant to add useless pics and thus increase the size of the mod. How about if I add really small 1 pixel b/w bitmaps to the mod as placeholders?. Would that work with your programm ? Maybe the gaps would be less ugly then.

Urendi Maleldil - Yeah, monster hunters would be cool. I still have a lot to do with the monsters themselves, though. Step 2 of the monster project is already in the planning and there are some fixes that need to be done before that as well. One problem that I am seeing, though, is the politics for the monster hunters. Unless MM adds feuds to the politics (that has been requested by some people and would make a lot of sense for races like Eee vs. Drushocka or Rage vs. Vaxin), I currently do not see a way to do the hunters correctly. For now, I guess, human players have to take up the role as monster hunters .

Well, it is way past my bedtime...

Rollo

[dogscoff]

Still playing, it is turning into one hell of a game.

The monsters dominate the game entirely, they have massive fleets of huge monsters cruising around demolishing anything in their path.

There are about 12 surviving ais and myself, and with one exception we are all on peaceful terms with one-another (even the xenophobes) and have been all game. I think the monsters have triggered MEE.

I'm in second place, with inferior weapons tech but advanced stellar manip. I'm probably about 20 turns away from building a star-destroyer and removing the monsters' home systems from the map=-)

I'm really interested to see what happens to interstellar politics once the monsters are taken out of the game.

One small comment about the monsters: They use all offensive intel. I understand that they need to have intel production to defend from crew insurrection etc, but it isn't very realistic to have them stealing my ships and empire data. Could I sugest giving them their own intel tech, with counter intel and maybe a few "special" intel projects: for example, rename the ship bomb so that it says "tiny space monsters have caused damage to your ship" or something.

Make these atatcks very rare though -The only way I can think of doing this is to perhaps replicate the "harmless" projects (ie census thefts) lots of times, and take out all descriptions and warnings from them, so that the target empire isn't aware of them happening. If these "blank" projects outnumbered the destructive projects by 10 or 20 to one, and the AI was selecting from them randomly, they should only carry out an offensive intel project very rarely.

[Rollo]

<snip>One small comment about the monsters: They use all offensive intel. I understand that they need to have intel production to defend from crew insurrection etc, but it isn't very realistic to have them stealing my ships and empire data. Could I sugest giving them their own intel tech, with counter intel and maybe a few "special" intel projects: for example, rename the ship bomb so that it says "tiny space monsters have caused damage to your ship" or something.
<snip>

Hmm, that's bad. The Monsters are not supposed to use offensive intel. I assume they have gotten "Basic Intel" from somewhere. (FYI, I have added basic intel to the Mod to prevent Monsters using any intel except defense).

That is one of the things that I hope to have fixed in the next (unreleased) Version. I increased the number of monster tech levels, so they will research only that to infinity (well, not really, but in game terms). Also I have set "will demand surrender" to False in the politics, so they shouldn't get tech from surrenders.

Not sure that I like the suggestion of special offensive intel projects. I would rather have them use intel for defense only.

Thanks for the feedback, Dogscoff. Your observation about all the races being on peaceful terms, because of the MEE monsters is consistant with mine. I'll change the MEE settings to a larger value for AI, because I don't think that this effect is desirable.

Rollo

edit:typos

[ May 17, 2002, 18:37: Message edited by: Rollo ]

[dogscoff]

Thanks for the feedback, Dogscoff. Your observation about all the races being on peaceful terms, because of the MEE monsters is consistant with mine. I'll change the MEE settings to a larger value for AI, because I don't think that this effect is desirable.

I dunno... I'm now in the position where a dozen or so well-established empires are bordering one another in relative peace (a few fights have broken out) and the monsters are about to be eliminated. I can't wait, I reckon all hell will break loose as the AIs turn on one another (and me) at the same time. My Ringworld should be ready by then. I'm gonna wipe the floor with them.

Not sure that I like the suggestion of special offensive intel projects

I guess they'd be like the random events. Could be fun: "Giant space lobsters have eaten 20000 Organics from your storage facilities." heheheh.

[Derek]

Rollo:

In my Derek's Mod Gold, which, as you know, includes your monsters, I've also seen the monsters use some offensive intel. I have also seen games where no-one uses any offensive intel at all. Rather strange.

Let me know what fixes you make, so I can include them in Derek's Mod Gold; that is, if you don't mind

Thanks
Derek