.com.unity Forums
  The Official e-Store of Shrapnel Games

This Month's Specials

Raging Tiger- Save $9.00
The Star and the Crescent- Save $9.00

   







Go Back   .com.unity Forums > Shrapnel Community > Space Empires: IV & V

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old May 6th, 2002, 05:23 PM

Sinapus Sinapus is offline
Second Lieutenant
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Houston, TX, USA
Posts: 571
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Sinapus is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Size Does Matter

On point-defense... I've noticed something odd on the latest Gold Versions. It seems like point-defense is destroying only one missile per shot. I don't know if this is because damage no longer overlaps when you hit a group of seekers or something else. I haven't had the chance to test the theory in the simulator yet.

Size-wise, I tend to make a swarm of destroyer-hulled ships combined with some bigger ships. But then I play tactical combat, so I can maneuver the ships more effectively.

[ 06 May 2002: Message edited by: Sinapus ]

__________________
--
...can you and your associates arrange that for me, Mr. Morden?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old May 6th, 2002, 05:36 PM
Captain Kwok's Avatar

Captain Kwok Captain Kwok is offline
National Security Advisor
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 5,624
Thanks: 1
Thanked 14 Times in 12 Posts
Captain Kwok is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Size Does Matter

quote:
On point-defense... I've noticed something odd on the latest Gold Versions. It seems like point-defense is destroying only one missile per shot. I don't know if this is because damage no longer overlaps when you hit a group of seekers or something else. I haven't had the chance to test the theory in the simulator yet.


It seems that way because point-defense power is about equal to missile damage resistance. They are each around 50 or so hit points near their max tech level.

I'm fairly certain that missile damage carries over...
__________________
Space Empires Depot | SE:V Balance Mod
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old May 6th, 2002, 06:22 PM

Cyrien Cyrien is offline
First Lieutenant
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Texas
Posts: 626
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Cyrien is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Size Does Matter

quote:
Originally posted by cascalonginus:

Size of attacking fleet vs vessel size. In the first case, more ships invariably prevail regardless of tech differences of the smaller opponents.
---
Any comments & pointers would be most appreciated.



Not true!

Take this true to life example
______
He had
Battle Cruisers (40-50) and Cruisers (10-20) with light Carriers (I think) (5-10). He had no support ships in this fleet.

His ships were a mixed lot. Combined arms theory maybe?

BCs had either APB max tech, PPB max tech, or Null Space level 2 or 3 all with best mount. 1 or 2 max tech not-phased shields. max tech ecm, combat sensors. no armor. I don't really know about exp level but I would guess it was low. Something in my head says so (listen to the voice...) 2nd best engines +1 moves trait bonus. 3 or 4 pd per ship (I wasn't using fighters or missiles so this was a waste against me, though the AI was missile heavy). He used bridge with crew quarters, life support. Had no racial advantages in combat/defense.
EDIT: He also had a few with incinerator 2 or 3 beams.

The CRs were missile ships level 3 or 4 CSM. They also had minesweepers on them. But mostly missiles.

The carriers were nothing but launch bays and cargo space. Took 4 or 5 turns for him to launch all the fighters from em. Launched em in Groups of 10 with a little leftover for a smaller group each turn.
The fighters themselves were small with mini APBs no shielding, 5 or 6 engines second best type.

I don't know what his battle strategy was. But his beam ships seemed to keep at a distance (YAY) his missile ships were way out at extreme range. His carriers launched and ran for the corners and his fighters tried for point blank. All broke formation.
______
I had
BattleCruisers (15-25). That is it, not multiple designs. A single ship design that hopefully had everything it needed as long as it remained in a system with a star.

I was using Meson BLasters with the largest mount available max tech. 1 Max tech phased shield. Max PD two per ship. Best engine in the game. 1 max tech shield regenerator. scatter + stealth armor. 1 minesweeper. 3 or 4 max tech solar panels. 1 max tech combat sensor + ecm + Multitrackx4.
My ships and fleet were elite exp with a 5% racial trait defensive bonus and advanced engine for +1 moves. Maybe one or two other things that I don't remember. Oh. Master Computer max tech.

My strategy was: has weapons, nearest, strongest, fastest
break formation
fire until no weapons left
max weapons range
_________

End result
He loses every single Last ship in a single (maybe two) combat engagements. I lose... half the shields on two of my ships with a little shielding damage on a few others. Not a single shot fired breached my shielding. The Null Space weapons got off a few shots but every Last one of them missed. The fighters were decimated by PD. The missiles were either A> Outrun or B> decimated by PD.

This battle took place not by my wish (I thought I would lose) I knew his fleet was out there but I knew not where. I warped through a warp point to help an AI ally out with my mobile fleet and the enemy was on the other side. Thus both our fleets started in close proximity. He had more ships than his strategy allowed and thus about half of them were scattered all over the combat field in seemingly chaotic array. Both of us were using double wall close formation.

My conclusion from this is. It doesn't matter how many the enemy is if he can't hit you and you can hit him.

Learn well from the mistakes of others grasshopper.

[ 06 May 2002: Message edited by: Cyrien ]

[ 06 May 2002: Message edited by: Cyrien ]

[ 06 May 2002: Message edited by: Cyrien ]

__________________
Oh hush, or I'm not going to let you alter social structures on a planetary scale with me anymore. -Doggy!
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old May 6th, 2002, 08:29 PM
Rollo's Avatar

Rollo Rollo is offline
Brigadier General
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Kiel, Germany
Posts: 1,896
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rollo is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Size Does Matter

quote:
Originally posted by DirectorTsaarx:
I like the idea of separate PD classes to defend against seekers & fighters. Should (can?) there be separate types of PD to target satellites & drones?
I guess the only problem would be getting the AI to use the new PD components effectively.



Devnull Mod uses two kinds of PD with different targets. The classic PDC can hit seekers only. The Anti-Fighter-Missile does more damage but has reload 2 and can hit seekers/fighters/drones/sats. The AI uses them without any problem, because PDC also act as mine sweeping components. So you can add PDC with the "mine sweeping" ability and "point defense" will give you Anti-Fighter missiles once they are available. This among other things needs a lot of changes to the AI design files, of course.

quote:
Originally posted by Sinapus:
On point-defense... I've noticed something odd on the latest Gold Versions. It seems like point-defense is destroying only one missile per shot. I don't know if this is because damage no longer overlaps when you hit a group of seekers or something else. I haven't had the chance to test the theory in the simulator yet.



No offense, but was that ever different? If I am not terribly mistaken, I recall doing some testing with missiles having really low (5 or 10) damage resistance under 1.49 (or 1.41) and found that one shot from a PD cannon would only destroy one seeker.

Rollo

edit: typos

[ 06 May 2002: Message edited by: Rollo ]

__________________
SE4
Devnull Mod Gold:
Version 1.80
Dungeon Odyssey:
Hack and Slash
Version 0.53e
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old May 6th, 2002, 10:58 PM

Phoenix-D Phoenix-D is offline
National Security Advisor
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 5,085
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Phoenix-D is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Size Does Matter

"If I am not terribly mistaken, I recall doing some testing with missiles having really low (5 or 10) damage resistance under 1.49 (or 1.41) and found that one shot from a PD cannon would only destroy one seeker."

Yup. Remember the fighter missiles from that Techmod test? Low HP, but since PD would only kill one missile per shot, a LOT got through.

Phoenix-D
__________________
Phoenix-D

I am not senile. I just talk to myself because the rest of you don't provide adequate conversation.
-Digger
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old May 6th, 2002, 11:20 PM
Rollo's Avatar

Rollo Rollo is offline
Brigadier General
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Kiel, Germany
Posts: 1,896
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rollo is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Size Does Matter

quote:
Originally posted by Phoenix-D:
"If I am not terribly mistaken, I recall doing some testing with missiles having really low (5 or 10) damage resistance under 1.49 (or 1.41) and found that one shot from a PD cannon would only destroy one seeker."

Yup. Remember the fighter missiles from that Techmod test? Low HP, but since PD would only kill one missile per shot, a LOT got through.

Phoenix-D



Yes, that is exactly what I meant. Thanks.

Rollo
__________________
SE4
Devnull Mod Gold:
Version 1.80
Dungeon Odyssey:
Hack and Slash
Version 0.53e
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:44 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©1999 - 2025, Shrapnel Games, Inc. - All Rights Reserved.