Forthcoming patch notes

[NTJedi]

Xietor said:
without a new game engine, i imagine increasing the length of battles may make the delay between turns unbearable in large games.

But that is just a guess.

Depends on the computer, which is why an adjustable battlefield turn setting would work best.

[WraithLord]

I second NT Jedi and concur with his reasoning.
I suggest a humble increase of the turn limit to 100, and optionally (hopefully also) make it adjustable.

[Gandalf Parker]

Keep in mind when you talk about increasing things that you are talking globally. You arent talking about increasing the number of units and turns in a battle. You are talking about increasing the number of units and turns in 1500 battles.

Actually I guess its even more than the # of Provinces limit since you can have 2 or 3 battles in some provinces.

[llamabeast]

Only a small proportion of battles last 50 turns, so only a small proportion would be affected. Also, the majority of the processing time is often spent on the early turns of a battle, when there are more units alive and more mages awake.

So I would suggest that the effect on the processing time of a turn would not be that large.

Personally, I would be very much in favour of including an option for the battle turn limit. I can't see any disadvantages, and I expect that the majority of multiplayer hosts would choose a higher limit than the current 50 turns.

[Gandalf Parker]

Im not sure how such things are handled in the code but if any part of it involves having to have an array large enough to handle the maxs then it would have overflowing impacts. We didnt realize all the different maxs that had to be increasd when we increased the number of provinces. It took a long time to find all the crashes that could generate.

But in general I also wouldnt mind a setting for it.

[Baalz]

Meh, this is such a non-issue.

Mindless units and leaders have a weakness that they can't retreat, so you need to deploy them with that in mind and avoid armies that they can't damage fast enough. I'm ok with that, that's a strategic decision when deploying golems. I'll also get screwed if a non-fire resistant SC stumbles upon a bunch of summer lions. It's just a weakness to keep in mind.

50 turns is plenty for most battles. One of the considerations for SC builds *should* be outputting enough damage, not just regenerating fast enough. If you're using a frost brand and your opponent spams you with undead - well you just got outmaneuvered.

I think it's kind of silly to complain that the turn limit isn't realistically modeling warfare. Come on guys, we're playing a game. Flying units teleport around the battlefield and can be attacked by melee, you die if you run away from an assassin, and its impossible to command your mages *not* to cast a specific spell. You plan your strategies around the boundaries of the game, it seems rather silly to carry on at length about reinforcements and how long the fights last. This is a turn based game, combat lasts 50 turns. Plan your strategies accordingly.

[Tifone]

It takes me ages to explain my thoughts about things. Then Baalz comes and is able to say almost everything I think better and faster than me. Life is so unjust

[Rathar]

Baalz, that was perfectly put imho. Play within the parameters set before you not play with the parameters.

Although I would bump the turn limit up by a touch as the current limit is left over from previous editions of dominions and average army size has changed a bit for the greater.

[NTJedi]

Baalz said:
Meh, this is such a non-issue.

Mindless units and leaders have a weakness that they can't retreat, so you need to deploy them with that in mind and avoid armies that they can't damage fast enough. I'm ok with that, that's a strategic decision when deploying golems.

Not retreating is fine, yet nothing justifies or explains the instant death of these units and commanders on the battlefield. As mentioned earlier a limbo state should occur which already exists as seen when using map edit commands and placing three nations within one province.

Baalz said:
50 turns is plenty for most battles. One of the considerations for SC builds *should* be outputting enough damage, not just regenerating fast enough. If you're using a frost brand and your opponent spams you with undead - well you just got outmaneuvered.

True and since a draw occurs between both sides either the attacker should be moved into a nearby friendly province or left in limbo on top of the province to attack again next turn.
Nothing justifies or explains the instant death which occurs.

Baalz said:
I think it's kind of silly to complain that the turn limit isn't realistically modeling warfare. Come on guys, we're playing a game. Flying units teleport around the battlefield and can be attacked by melee, you die if you run away from an assassin, and its impossible to command your mages *not* to cast a specific spell.

Flying units appear to teleport because the game doesn't provide a vertical map movement, dying from an assassin by retreating is another illogical flaw discussed on the forums which conflicts with historical assassinations, and mages *not* casting a specific spell is a game limitation which should be improved possibly within Dom_4 since it's too late for the current game engine and it's been requested by many gamers.
Just because the game has illogical flaws doesn't mean they cannot be improved as seen with the current game settings verses game settings from DOM_2.

Baalz said:
You plan your strategies around the boundaries of the game, it seems rather silly to carry on at length about reinforcements and how long the fights last. This is a turn based game, combat lasts 50 turns. Plan your strategies accordingly.

It's more with creating a more logical fantasy environment. The battlefield turn limits cause illogical and unjust retreats plus some unjust deaths. Allowing the game to evolve into a better and more realistic fantasy realm is a good thing.

[WraithLord]

Baalz said:
Meh, this is such a non-issue.

Mindless units and leaders have a weakness that they can't retreat, so you need to deploy them with that in mind and avoid armies that they can't damage fast enough. I'm ok with that, that's a strategic decision when deploying golems. I'll also get screwed if a non-fire resistant SC stumbles upon a bunch of summer lions. It's just a weakness to keep in mind.

50 turns is plenty for most battles. One of the considerations for SC builds *should* be outputting enough damage, not just regenerating fast enough. If you're using a frost brand and your opponent spams you with undead - well you just got outmaneuvered.

I think it's kind of silly to complain that the turn limit isn't realistically modeling warfare. Come on guys, we're playing a game. Flying units teleport around the battlefield and can be attacked by melee, you die if you run away from an assassin, and its impossible to command your mages *not* to cast a specific spell. You plan your strategies around the boundaries of the game, it seems rather silly to carry on at length about reinforcements and how long the fights last. This is a turn based game, combat lasts 50 turns. Plan your strategies accordingly.

I don't agree its a non-issue, I don't think its a big issue but I would like to see the turn limit raised a bit. Frankly I don't understand the adamant objection, why would someone object to having this as a setting. If you don't like it, set it to 50 and be done with it and allow the players that like to raise it to do so.

I do agree with all the rest but I find the reasoning incomplete. Yes, I also find it silly to look for realism as justification for wanting a change to rules esp. going to nitpicks such as analyzing how many minutes are represented by a battle turn. And yes, I also agree that a player should accept and adjust to the game rules. However, and this is where I think the reasoning to be incomplete, players are entitled to have their own minds on what rules they like and what not. And also, game rules can and do change according to what the audience likes (see NBA for example).

So it all boils down to what players like. I personally would like to see the turn limit raised to 100 (as default) and hopefully be made adjustable (so that anyone who is particularly fond of the 50 turn limit can set it).

IW are probably reading this thread. No comment from them could mean they're not decided which probably means this is not going to happen. It doesn't change the fact that a lot of players find the turn limit annoying and limiting for the rare epic army vs. army battles and the SC vs huge armies battles.