Preferred Country and OOB

[Lt. Ketch]

Hey, I just want to throw this out. What is the "best" group of units to have for your core forces in a campaine? List your preferred country as well please. Here's my current line up. Please critique it! I would like imput and ideas.

Germany
~Sept 1943

Armour
14 Pather Ds
6 Tigers

Recon
2 Scout HT
2 Brandenburg Scouts
1 Helo Drache

Infantry
6 Brandenburg Eng
2 formations of Pz mech inf each with:
1 SMG unit
2 Rifle
1 Strum(Flame) eng. (previously MG)

Other
2 Ferdinand TD (Previously Nashhorns)
4 SP 37mm Flak (for the blastedly efftive RAF and USAF)

[blitzkreig]

Depends what your aiming for, a realasitic combined arms unit or a gamey win at all costs "power force" like you have chosen here.

Personally the use of of helicopters as scout units in anything other than "what if games" really anoys me as they were not used in such a role till after the Korean war and were barely in use in WW2 at all.

Give me a points value and I'll post my "typical" core force if you like. They are normally found chasing Panzer bob round the map in a PBEM.

I do wonder if you have enough Infantry though for holding those all important objectives and for supporting your Panzers in close terrain.

[Lt. Ketch]

Yes, I acknowledge that I have the "win at all costs 'power force'" It's not something I do proudly, but I do acknowledge it. I like the Helo for recon because it's easier to keep alive. I'm experimenting with smaller forces (5-6 formations) and haven't had much luck yet. I would also need to do some more research before I can build the historical OOB. I'm familiar with what equipment was used when, but not in what numbers or depolyment.

I believe I build this with right around 2000 pts. How would you build from that?

In regards to the infantry question. Yes, I find it a little tight trying to cover the ground and support my tanks with my 12 infantry squads. Next time I will certainly have more. I'm still trying to get back into the groove of SP. I played it when it first came out and have only recently discovered winSPWW2 and it's not quite like riding a bike.

[blitzkreig]

Well where to start! There is no such thing as a perfect core choice I guess. It very much depends on your play style. Your chosen core would be very effective agaisnt the AI I'm sure. I get my pleasure from more challenging games so I tend to use historical forces agaisnt the AI. I also love to play PBEM games where balanced historicaly accurate forces add to a more challenging and enjoyable battle.

There are other factors to consider when picking your core. Whether you like to play with the AI tank heavy option on or off can make a differance as can the size of the map and nautre of the terrain your campaign will be fought over.

Some players like to include Arty and FOOS in their core to gain the benefit from the increased experiance and effectiveness these units gain over time. Others include Scouts for the same reasons. Personally I only take these units in my core in very large campaigns. In small sized battles I take them as support chocies depending on mission and terrian factors.

I normally like very large battles so normally base my KG around a core choice of a Pz Gren Btl.

2000 point core choices:

Core 1:

KG HQ:

Kommander, 1 x Sdkfz 250/12 ( a FO vehicle meant to simulate the KG commaders command SPW which would have more radio gear)

1 x SS Pz Gren Kp (Gep)

Kp HQ: 1 x SMG Gruppe, 1 x Rifle Gruppe, 2 x Sdkfz 251

3 x SS Pz Gren Zug (Gep): 1 x SMG Gruppe, 2 Rilfe gruppe,
1 x Sdkfz 251/10, 3 x Sdkfz 251

1 x Heavy Zug: 2 x Sdkfz 251/9, 2 Sdkfz 251/2 SP Mortars,
2 x MG 34 MMG Gruppe (4 MG 34 in total)
2 x Sdkfz 251

2 x SS Pz Zug: Each with 5 x Pz IVH

2 x FlaK Gruppe: 4 Sdkfz 7/2 37mm SP flak

A mobile hard hitting KG able to rapidly move about the battlefield and fight the foe on terrian of their chosing

Core 2:

KG HQ: Kommander, 1 x Kubel Wagon

2 x SS Pz Gren Kp (Mot):

KP HQ
3 x Pz Gren Zug (mot)
1 x heavy Zug: Transport zug 3 x Opel
Mortar Gruppe 2x 81mm Mortar
MG Zug: 2 x MG 34 MMG Gruppe (4 MG 34 MMG Total)

2 x Stug Zug: 6 Stugs total
1 x Pz Jager Gruppe : 2 x Marder
1 x SP Flak Gruppe: 2 x 20mm SP flak

A large core with more boots on the ground able to move forward quickly before debusing a safe distance from the foward battle area and advancing on foot.

The thing to remember with the German oob is that almostt any combination of units is a "valid hisotical" force as Kampfgruppe where often hastily but together for a variety of missions.

However remember that units like Tigers, heavy calbier arty and brandernburgers were coprs lvl assets or higher and so were only used on the most important sectors of the battlefield at key times. Elite Army and SS units did however tend to have a more of these powerful units availbe to them.

Have fun gaming and I'd really recommend trying out PBEM battles!

[narwan]

A good site to get an idea of historical OB's:

http://www.orbat.com/site/ww2/drleo/...min/000oob.htm


Specific OB's for german armored (incl mech) formations:

http://chrito.users1.50megs.com/kstn/kstnpanzermain.htm


Plenty more to be found online.


Narwan

[Cross]

SP mostly deals in battalion sized engagements. The most useful site I've found that clearly explains the makeup of various Battalions is here:

http://www.bayonetstrength.150m.com/...l/site_map.htm

It has the major powers plus Commonwealth nations.

The evolution of the various battalions through WWII are detailed; and there's a wealth of other info here too. Recommend it.

[PanzerBob]

Panzer Bob's G2 Staff takes in this latest intelligence coupe, LOL Naw just kidding, As if Blitzkrieg would telegraph the ORBAT's to his KG opposing me right now!!

I must admit I usually try to stay on the historical path but at times or as time goes by in a Campaign the temptation is there to include things like Helicopters. Then again these innovations don't mean a guaranteed win. While Helos can spot they can also can be seen and shot down. Well-hidden recce can give you permanent eyes on the enemy.

My rule of thumb for winSPWWII depends on which country I'm playing and size of the unit, plus whether I'm playing a Human Commander However if I'm playing Battalion plus sizes in Campaign here's my thoughts and preferences:

Germans- SS KG’s 50/50 Panzer/Inf Mix, less Panzers if Heavy Panzers. Armoured Car/Mech Scouts/MC's for Recce. SPAA depends on dates. Arty depends on whether PBEM or AI Campaign.

As time/battles progress, besides upgrades, add Inf Protection, AT, AAA, and MG assets as possible. Plus additions like engineering assets.

Allies- US/UK/Cdn Army 66/34 Armour/Inf Mix, Armour with good Gun to Speed ratio, and Inf with good AT cap if available. Large Mech/Scout Recce Unit if feasible and lots of Arty or Large Caliber or mix depending on whether PBEM or AI Campaign.

As time/battles progress, besides upgrades, add Inf Protection and Inf AT cap, AT, and AAA as possible. Plus additions like engineering assets.

Now with all this being said, Campaigns like the Long Campaign against the AI, while starting historical, the length of the Campaign tends to make ones KG quite formidable and certainly not historical in equipment, structure yes, but not equipment.

AND, of course it sometimes boils down to what I’m trying to simulate.

Bob out