Magic Items under CBM

[Sombre]

Originally Posted by Amorphous

I am of the opinion that if something is really worthless, then it should not be present in the stats of an item - the story around it may be a different thing. And if you remove the pillage bonus from the axe, I do not really see it as the same axe anymore. Conceivably I could be convinced otherwise.

You can't remove the pillage bonus from the axe.

[Mardagg]

Ok,since i will be away for 1-2 days soon,i will summarize what we got so far:


1-Handed Items

-nerfing the Fire and Frost Brand is undecided

-improving Sword of Swiftness is only of minor importance,if at all

-making the Shadow Brand stronger and more expensive seems declined

2-Handed Items

-improving Wraith Sword by quite a lot is accepted

-certain other 2h items need to be improved is accepted

Shields

-Vine shield being overpowered is undecided
(how does the strength check exactly work?)

Uniques

-making fever fetish non-unique is declined

- the need for a new easier available earth booster is accepted
(personally i like the idea of making the tome of gaiea non-unique and naming it e.g. bloodroot manual(like sombre said) very much)

[Mardagg]

I would like to point the discussion now towards the Hell Sword a bit,i mentioned it already in the opening post.
Its certainly better than its "Death cousin" at the moment,but still underpowered imo.
And if you make the Wraith Sword stronger,u gotta make the Hell Sword stronger,it feels.
I do share some concerns here though,that have been brought up for the Wraith Sword.
Fire and Blood magic is only for some nations and Blood is easily massable.That way,the Hellsword could easily be made overpowered.

Current stats are:
15 Blood/10 Fire , 3/0 Att/def,9 damage
Partial Life drain,FR 50%,Berserk +3

Its the special effects that make it better than the WS,but the raw point values are slightly worse,simply too bad for a heavy 2 handed weapon,meant to be Construction 6.
I think one of the following ideas would be thematic:

1.Increasing attack to 6 or 7,maybe increasing damage in addition,to like 12-14
or
2.making it Armor piercing and maybe increasing attack to 4-5

What do you think?

[Amorphous]

Originally Posted by Sombre

You can't remove the pillage bonus from the axe.

My thinking was more in the line of effectively removing the axe and creating a new weapon with fear and the same look, but no pillage bonus.

Is that not possible?

[Squirrelloid]

Originally Posted by Amorphous

My thinking was more in the line of effectively removing the axe and creating a new weapon with fear and the same look, but no pillage bonus.

Is that not possible?

Why not just increase the damage and stats on the axe so someone might think about actually making/using one? I mean, so it has a pillaging bonus... whatever. That's not worth anything, so it shouldn't effect our valuation of what it does and what it should do.

[Sombre]

Originally Posted by Amorphous

My thinking was more in the line of effectively removing the axe and creating a new weapon with fear and the same look, but no pillage bonus.

Is that not possible?

No. It's also pointless, since you can just boost the imp axe and ignore the pillage bonus no-one cares about.

If you want to know what's actually possible rather than having to ask me or assume anything, I suggest looking in the mod manual. In fact no-one should be allowed to post in this thread unless they actually understand what can be done to weapons/items via mod commands.

[Valerius]

Originally Posted by Sombre

In fact no-one should be allowed to post in this thread unless they actually understand what can be done to weapons/items via mod commands.

Well, I'm glad it's been clarified who is allowed to post in this thread.

[Sombre]

Originally Posted by Valerius

Well, I'm glad it's been clarified who is allowed to post in this thread.

Your sarcasm has made me see the light. Let's all suggest things that can't be done and argue with each other about them at great length rather than spend the five minutes or so required to understand the limits of weapon and item modding. You know, by reading the doc readily available to every single person who has patched their game up to date. Expecting people to have done this before weighing in is nearly as unreasonable as expecting people to have used CBM or actually played dominions before posting here.

[Valerius]

Originally Posted by Sombre

Your sarcasm has made me see the light.

A sarcastic response to sarcasm. How novel.

Originally Posted by Sombre

Let's all suggest things that can't be done blah, blah, blah.

I could spend time arguing this but it's pointless. It's really very simple. You are not one to let an opportunity for snideness or obnoxiousness pass. It's what you do.

[Amorphous]

Originally Posted by Sombre

No. It's also pointless, since you can just boost the imp axe and ignore the pillage bonus no-one cares about.

Very well, if it cannot be done, the aesthetics of it is rather moot.

Looking at the axe, it really does not seem that bad in itself - fear is a reasonably powerful effect. It seems to me that at least part of the problem is that the Horror Helmet is available at the same level of construction with path requirements that make it likely that anyone able and willing to craft the axe, could craft the helmet instead. Perhaps bumping the helmet up to construction 4 would help.



Now regarding the general situation of 2-handers vs 1-handers and shields, I want to reinforce that cost is important. Sure, you usually build a number of top SCs in each game where a couple of gems here or there does not make any big difference, but at least for thugs, the same gems do matter. If you make a 5-gem 2-hander just as good as the combination of a 5-gem 1-hander and a 10-gem shield, the 2-hander is going to be built in the vast majority of cases.

Also it seems to me that a good number of the 2-handers discussed here are decidedly low-level. And in the early game, a mage turn is a lot more expensive than it is later, relatively speaking. And the number of gems needed is even more critical.

In the end, a construction 4 item should probably see use more often in the game once that level of construction is researched.

If you compare a 5-gem level 0 item to a combination of a 5-gem level level 0 item and a 10 gem level 4 item, the latter should be better in most situations.


Off topic:

Originally Posted by Sombre

If you want to know what's actually possible rather than having to ask me or assume anything, I suggest looking in the mod manual. In fact no-one should be allowed to post in this thread unless they actually understand what can be done to weapons/items via mod commands.

I am sorry if my question rubbed you the wrong way; that was not my intention.

If you do not think relevant or want to answer one of my questions, just ignore it. I am not quite so self-centred that I regard you or anyone as having a duty to answer a question just because I ask it.

It also seems like my wording threw you off and you took my question a bit too literally. In my defence I will say that it never entered my mind that anyone would interpret my words so narrowly as to think I meant using the newweapon-command and adding the ability directly to the structure (hope that was clear enough).

Admittedly I have done very little modding and most of what I have done has concerned monsters, but all the more reason to ask when it comes to magic items, in my opinion. Quite a few things are not exhaustively covered in the modding manual and among them is what items hide at construction 12. For all I know, there could be a number of nifty single-ability items there that could be used on occasions such as this. From your response, though, I gather that this is not the case.

Again, I am sorry if I offended you with my question.