Conceptual Balance Mod v1.92

[Shangrila00]

Originally Posted by earcaraxe

I wanted to clear that up if we are arguing about "unplayable" or "not strong enough".

Actually only Ghoul was arguing either unplayable, or not strong enough, and he really didn't say much beyond that. Executor was (and still is?) arguing that Ashdod is impossible to balance with Adonim because it was and still is massively OP, and I was arguing against that. There was also a side argument on whether or not some of the nerfs against Ashdod were justified, with the understanding that no, the nerfs don't make Ashdod weak, but neither would the lack of them make Ashdod OP, and so CBM didn't really have any business making those changes for thematic reasons.

Edit: somewhat lost in the shuffle was how Seren can be made useable. Which is related as Anakite armor being the worst heavy armor in the game is one reason nobody would recruit them, as cheap as they are.

[rdonj]

Dude, shangrila, for as much as you claim executor was making personal attacks it is hard not to read a large amount of hostility from you in what you're directing at him. You are making this excessively personal. Can we back this up a couple of steps?

[Valerius]

Originally Posted by Shangrila00

There was also a side argument on whether or not some of the nerfs against Ashdod were justified, with the understanding that no, the nerfs don't make Ashdod weak, but neither would the lack of them make Ashdod OP, and so CBM didn't really have any business making those changes for thematic reasons.

I'll agree with the first part, that the nerfs don't make them weak - but not with the second. Ashdod was originally nerfed because it was viewed as OP. I understand you may not view it that way but the fact is it was commonly banned from games. And it's most certainly CBM's business to address that since I view CBM as being MP focused (at least with regards to balance decisions). Really, the question is do you want the nation to be playable or banned half the time?

As for the nerfs, they mostly had to do with gold cost. I'd agree some of those are now too high, in particular the Talmai Elder at 600 gold. I'd also agree with Executor's comment that it wouldn't be out of line to reduce the cost of zamzummite's.

But none of the changes were unthematic, unless you consider the theme to be "IW created an OP nation deliberately." But in that case I'd say balance trumps "theme" - at least in a MP setting.

[ghoul31]

Ashdod is the only nation that can't get 0 enc sacreds. So nations with 0 enc sacreds can just slaughter them in the early game

I am the only one here who has actually played ashdod in 1.92, so I'm the only one that can comment on it.


Why don't some of you actually play them before you keep spouting nonsense?

but of course none of you will, and will just keep spouting nonsense with no real experience to back you up.

[Calahan]

Originally Posted by ghoul31

Ashdod is the only nation that can't get 0 enc sacreds. So nations with 0 enc sacreds can just slaughter them in the early game

I am the only one here who has actually played ashdod in 1.92, so I'm the only one that can comment on it.


Why don't some of you actually play them before you keep spouting nonsense?

but of course none of you will, and will just keep spouting nonsense with no real experience to back you up.

Ghoul you've never played any nation in the game, simply because you have no idea how to play the game at all. Therefore any opinion you have on anything is meaningless. And as evidence of your inability to play, I present your above bless for Ashdod, and your complete failure to compete in any game you've ever played past the mid game (when 0enc super giants can no longer survive against magic).

This happens in every game you play (and you know it does) because you have no concept of the power curve, you never do research, you never build several strong mage bases, you always over-commit to every war you fight (top tip, vet players often use less than 50% of their forces to win their first war, and also try to win their first war without using any mages). With most of these points being the reason you keep getting ganged. ie. it has othing to do with players beign "****ing cowards" as you keep claiming. As the reason is they scout your lands, notice you have no troops or mages anywhere in sight. As you've committed everything you have, and ever have had, into just one war. Then they check the graphs and note you are bottom on research, so have no way of defending yourself with mages. they then add 1+1 together, and get the answer that they can take over your entire empire very quickly and very easily. So why the hell shouldn't they do it? (top tip, if your first war lasts more than 20 turns, you've already lost the game. And if you win your first, and your second lasts longer than 10 turns, then again you've lost the game. Quick wars are essential to staying on the power curve)

If you think how you play the game right now is how the game should be played, then I can assure you that you will not only never win a game ever, but you will not even get close to winning a game ever. As you are trying to play in a way that makes failure a 100% certainty. In chess terms (since it's the worlds most widely played strategy game) you are moving your queen out on move two of every game you play, trying to capture as many pawns as you can with her, and then crying like a girl when you lose your queen or you get checkmated (due to your opponents superior piece development), and then blaming either the game or your opponent for your loss. Rather than facing the truth which is that you have no idea at all how chess is really played. And until you accept you have no idea, accept you have to change how you play, and start learning the basics of playing properly, then you will never improve regardless of how many games you play, as it is impossible to improve with that play style. You could play 24/7 for 10 years and be no better than when you started.

But I couldn't care less if your Dom play improves at all, and you'll just ignore all this advice like you have done every single time anyone has tried helping you play better. And several players have tried helping you in the past, but you refuse to accept any criticism of your play because you always convice yourself that something else is the sole reason for you losing (****ing cowards!!!). As at the end of the day all I care about is that people realise how clueless you are as a player, and as such automatically ignore any assessment you make about a nation/mod/whatever.

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Originally Posted by Executor

Calahan, I finally get why you stopped posting anything or trying to be of help.

Glad to see you've finally seen the light. Maybe you should set up a sig. to commemorate it, like the one I have over on Dom3mods.

"Don't ever try to help pig-headed douche bags, as it's never worth the trouble. Since some people are just too stupid and arrogant to listen"

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Originally Posted by Ragnarok-X

Chill. I didnt say roll it back, i said it was overnerfed and i suggestion to UNDO the overnerf.

I'll chill when people stop posting rubbish. Which by recent evidence suggests never.