Soviet OOB 11: miscellaneous observations

[DRG]

Yes Michael, but there are no on map heavy guns in this game so the only use for a Heavy truck is to transport the heavy mortar section. Either way, there is WAY too much obsessing over trucks in this game by a tiny minority of players and I regret not putting an end to multiple truck types 2 decades ago and simply stuck with generic Light, medium and heavy truck. But it's a slippery slope...accomadate one request and then it turns into a flood and I have little interest of time to debate when a specific truck was introduce..... It's a waste of time and OOB slots and the VAST majority of players just want something that can carry what they want it to carry...ZiS-5-ZiS-4 is irrelevant. Truck light, medium, heavy nomenclature is mainly an indicator of what they can carry so that the correct carry capacity could be assigned so that players would not be offered types that could not carry the gun assigned but that started getting screwed up as more " detail " truck types were added that deviated in carry capacity from one to the other in the same class instead of sticking with generics so by trying to accommodate "historical accuracy" we created un-necessary complication.

That said, next release we have "solved" the problem of players having to be careful when buying towed guns/ mortars that the transport they pick to move it will actually carry the gun/ mortar they want to move about. Andy has added code that will ONLY list the vehicles that have the capacity to tow/ carry the gun/mortar that was selected which has allowed me to add things like Jeeps to the artillery prime mover class for light AT guns.....but if the player selects a 100mm ATG the jeep won't show as a possible transport choice.

This does not mean there is no use for Light, medium and heavy truck. I could change the Russian OOB so that the Hcy mortar were transported by prime mover class but that means 120 mm would be offered Stalinets and SOMEBODY would complain so things like the Russian Hvy Mor Pl/M will still be carried by a "Heavy Truck" Zis

[Pibwl]

Originally Posted by DRG

Yes Michael, but there are no on map heavy guns in this game so the only use for a Heavy truck is to transport the heavy mortar section.

There is very heavy on-map #366 122mm 31 FG (7t), but it wasn't towed by any truck anyway

BTW: there are no motorized howitzers currently.

Originally Posted by DRG

That said, next release we have "solved" the problem of players having to be careful when buying towed guns/ mortars that the transport they pick to move it will actually carry the gun/ mortar they want to move about.

That's a great news
Out of curiosity, which carry capacity is needed to carry guns with 1, 2 or 3 weight?

If you needed info on carry capability (typical loads), in order:
* Jeep / GAZ-67: 45 mm ATG (some 0.6t)
* Komsomolets: 45mm ATG, 76mm IG (0.8t)
* T-27 - surely nothing more than above

* T-26T: 76mm AT/FG (up to 2t)
* Dodge WC: 120mm mortars (0.5t), 57mm AT, 76mm AT/G (up to 2t)

* Studebaker: 76mm FG, 122mm FH (2.5t), 100mm AT (some 3t)
* STZ-5: 76mm AT/FG, 122mm FH, 85mm AA (4.5t)
* Halftrack: 57mm AT, 100 mm AT, 85mm AA
* ZiS-42: up to 85mm AA (4.5t)

* Stalinets, Ya-12: everything including 122mm FG (7t)

It seems, that 100mm ATG was practically in the same weight class as 85mm AA.

It's worth to copy #828 Studebaker, #043 Halftrack and ZiS-42 as prime movers, since it was one of their typical uses.

Possibly there's no need to create prime mover Jeeps - Light AT guns (class 157) can be towed by utility vehicles?

As for 120mm mortar question, unfortunately I have no info, what towed them before Dodge (apart from accidental usage of Komsomolets, and of course horses), but it seems there was no need of a heavy truck... just thinking. Pre-war heavy trucks on the other hand didn't tow guns, due to lack of off-road capabilities and too low power.

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Misc. comments:

344 Boys Carrier (utility veh.) - it seems, that Boys carrier should rather be available as an option for APC track class (like #467 Bren carrier). As utility vehicle, one MG should be enough (Bren or DT). BTW: carriers were most often known as "Universal Mk.I".

452 107mm Howitzer - should have single-tail icon 2117 (in fact, it was 107mm Field Gun)

86 Yak-9B - it could carry only up to 4x100 kg bombs (vertically, in a bomb bay). But this special variant (B- bomber) appeared only from 12/44. Ordinary Yak-9 fighters generally aren't known to carry bombs, nor even RS-82 rockets... At that time the Soviets seem to leave ground attacks to Il-2. Only early Yaks did carry rockets. They also could carry two bombs, but bomb racks were usually removed in units to improve performance.

144 Yak-9B - ...therefore I suggest to rename it to Yak-1, which, according to books, was fitted with RS-82 rockets from 10/41 (it should also have two #159 7.62 MGs instead of 12.7 one then). It could receive a new photo.

411 Yak-9U - as well, it could be changed to Yak-1, which received bombs around the same time as rockets (10/41?).

139 Yak-9T - heavier variant, with 37mm gun. Rockets should rather be removed

660 LaGG-1 - in fact, this designation was not used, and according to Russian books it was changed from a beginning to LaGG-3 (along with increased fuel tanks). But there were no aircraft armed with 2x20mm and 2x12.7mm. First aircraft had 3x12.7mm and 2x7.62mm, then from the 12th series most typical 1x20 and 1x12.7 mm.

Also, only from the 11th or 12th series (late 41) there were introduced rockets
First aircraft entered service only in 3/41 - so the unit #660 could be an early strafer, and the unit #661 might remain, with corrected guns. Same for guns of unit #140.

That's all as for now.
...I can't promise if there will be further research, I'm tired as well

[DRG]

Originally Posted by Pibwl

That's a great news
Out of curiosity, which carry capacity is needed to carry guns with 1, 2 or 3 weight?

It has always been crew size + weight.......if crew is 5 and gun weighs 1 then it needs a vehicle with a carry capacity of 6 or more to transport it

...but DO NOT even THINK about producing a list of " corrections" for this..... I'm NOT interested. All we did this for was to make it easier on players looking to find a vehicle that could transport a gun without the " surprise" on deployment that the vehicle chosen cannot tow the gun..... that will no longer be an issue but I am NOT going to start adjusting carry caps and weight to existing guns and vehicles.... whats there now is what it stays.

[DRG]

Originally Posted by Pibwl

That's all as for now.
...I can't promise if there will be further research, I'm tired as well

BELIEVE ME............It is IMPOSSIBLE for anyone to be more "tired" of this constant nit picking than I am.....