Mod Idea: Simulating surfaces -> Borg Technology -> Twinkie Physics -> Worldviews

[Will]

Originally posted by Krsqk:
If an evolutionist accepts that his worldview is a faith, he's already halfway to becoming a creationist. No one would naturally look at the complexity found in nature and say, "Wow! That happened by chance!" any more than they think the space shuttle happened by chance. We have to be taught to think that way.

Hmmm... Well, I say my worldview is largely based on my faith that there is/are no god(s). I understand that it is impossible to prove one way or the other, and thus would fall into the catagory of faith or belief. However, I am in no way "halfway to becoming a creationist". There have been numerous attempts by others to show me the "light", or the "way", or the "truth", or the "good news", or whatever else the current fad of a term is, and all of them failed (to borrow from the bedroom floor analogy, it always has failed, and I always expect it to fail). An "intelligent designer" does not fit well in my mind, it violates the principle of Occam's Razor... it seems like it is a layer of complexity from ages past when anything that wasn't understood was "God".

The space shuttle analogy is flawed. I know how it was created, off the top of my head, it was during the 1970s, designed by engineers at Boeing, built by Boeing on a NASA contract. I don't recall any details, really, and don't feel like googling it right now. But I know about its recent creation, by humans, from my junior high history courses. It is very probable that some of the people who designed and built it are still living. The same cannot be said for the Universe or the Earth. Nobody was around for that, and even if the inconsistant and contradictory information that the various "prophets" dictated actually were from a divine source, it has gone through the interpretations of far too many people over far too long of a time. Most elementary school students play a game, where one person makes up a message, and whispers it to someone else. That person whispers what he/she heard to another person, who whispers what he/she heard to another... etc. The Last person tells everyone what he/she heard, and the first person tells everyone what he/she originally said. I have not yet experienced a perfect transmission, or even one that was reasonably close. I see religious teachings in much the same way. Most of the substantiation for religious claims come from the claims themselves (I have stopped counting the number of times I've encountered a person who uses circular reasoning to justify the Bible... "The Bible is Truth because God says so." "How do you know that God said so?" "It says it right here in the Bible." "Well, how do you know the Bible is Truth?" "Because God says so."... etc.). The prophecies contained in religions, to me, reads a lot like daily horoscopes; very ambiguous, and anyone who wants to believe them will find a way to distort the facts of their existance to fit what is said.

As for this worldview being what I was taught... hardly. I grew up in an area that is approximately 40% Catholic, 30% Presbyterian, 30% Methodist, and largely hostile. I know of only three Jewish families. My school had an angry (extremist Christian) parents group that tried to block a field trip by a small group of students to the Andy Warhol Museum because the students would surely be corrupted and return as Satan-worshiping homosexuals. I am sure that many congregations still periodically pray for my soul. The threats made to me that said that the God-fearing Christian who wrote about his/her wish to speed me on my way to my false god, Satan, in Hell... those slacked off after the first few months. I think it's more because the writers found other things to be self-righteous about, rather than me endlessly explaining that athiests (as I later discovered the term to be) don't believe in Satan, either.
No, atheism was not something I was taught. I came to the conclusion that I didn't believe all that "God" nonsense on my own, thank you. Despite the many and varied attempts to teach me something that was not atheism, both before and after I actually knew what the word meant. The first atheist I met face to face (that I knew was an athiest, at least) I met about four months ago. In Los Angeles, not Pennsylvania (where I grew up, and formulated my worldview).

Hmm... I think I need to go to the Cantina for a while...