Golden Age Arcoscephale

[Graeme Dice]

Originally posted by Scott Hebert:
By daughter, do you mean the Daughter of the Land? I wasn't aware she was considered a Combat-oriented Pretender. I see as 'clam factory', normally.

She's the best of the 50 point humanoids, as she has giant stats, starts with water magic for quickness, and can easily afford to put another couple of paths at 3 magic for combat purposes. I use her with C'Tis an awful lot.

[numskully]

Blitz, your doing a very fine job on your subject. props to you, for it all makes sense.

the engineer has been brought up, but why is his resource cost 50? its hard enough to make units on this team (a team that isnt blood or death summoning).

[Scott Hebert]

Originally posted by Blitz:
Healing light and nether bolt are const 5 IIRC. With jotunheim that level of evocation is a high priority.

Er, don't you mean Evo intead of Const? They're actually Evocation-3 and -4, respectively. While interesting, about the only thing I would research early in Evocation is to get Arcane Probing. I would have to evaluate whether or not the other spells were worth it, that early in the game.

How do you use the Seithkonur, if you do get that high, though? I find it hard to imagine you're going to want to fire Nether Bolts into a melee, considering the effects should they hit your giants. OTOH, I don't see how they would be effective as a 'solo' magical attack squad. Do you use Vinemen to protect them, or something?

Honest question here. About the only time I do something like this (magical attack squads) is with Caelum.

To be perfectly honest, though, I almost prefer base Jotunheim to Utgard. Much better Bloodhunting.

I normally find with Jotunheim that I want rather high Enchantment, for Revenants and other fun Death stuff. With Utgard's increases focus on Astral magic, I can see why taking more Evocation is desirable, but I'm rather leery of trying to bring Seithkonur into combat without some sort of mass Communion or something.

[Scott Hebert]

Originally posted by numskully:
Blitz, your doing a very fine job on your subject. props to you, for it all makes sense.

I'm glad he's making sense to someone.

the engineer has been brought up, but why is his resource cost 50? its hard enough to make units on this team (a team that isnt blood or death summoning).

It's the price you pay for having castles that never fall.

[Scott Hebert]

Originally posted by Graeme Dice:

quote:

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Originally posted by Scott Hebert:
By daughter, do you mean the Daughter of the Land? I wasn't aware she was considered a Combat-oriented Pretender. I see as 'clam factory', normally.

She's the best of the 50 point humanoids, as she has giant stats, starts with water magic for quickness, and can easily afford to put another couple of paths at 3 magic for combat purposes. I use her with C'Tis an awful lot.

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Heh. I guess. I generally use a Lady of Fortune for those nations that can use her and have sacred units I want to use. 4-Water/4-Nature Bless rather nice, IMO.

But yeah, she's a rather basic chassis to build from. Those 2 water gems per turn just scream to be used for clams, though. I wish I could use her with Atlantis or Rlyeh.

[Blitz]

Er, don't you mean Evo intead of Const? They're actually Evocation-3 and -4, respectively. While interesting, about the only thing I would research early in Evocation is to get Arcane Probing. I would have to evaluate whether or not the other spells were worth it, that early in the game.

How do you use the Seithkonur, if you do get that high, though? I find it hard to imagine you're going to want to fire Nether Bolts into a melee, considering the effects should they hit your giants. OTOH, I don't see how they would be effective as a 'solo' magical attack squad. Do you use Vinemen to protect them, or something?

Healing light is pretty nice on smaller numbers of high HP giants. As for nether darts, I don't find I lose many giants to it, because of their high hps. Later in the game, SC's like ice devils are not affected much. It's particularily potent against SC Users who back those troops up with archers and mages, as the seithkona will fire into the back lines. Combined with relief, this provides excellent spell backup.

[Scott Hebert]

Originally posted by Blitz:
Healing light is pretty nice on smaller numbers of high HP giants.

I'll take your word for it; I've only seen it cast once or twice.

As for nether darts, I don't find I lose many giants to it, because of their high hps. Later in the game, SC's like ice devils are not affected much. It's particularily potent against SC Users who back those troops up with archers and mages, as the seithkona will fire into the back lines. Combined with relief, this provides excellent spell backup.

Okay, you're confusing me again... are you talking about Nether Darts (Evocation-7), or Nether Bolt (Evocation-4)?

Doesn't the feeblemind effect hurt normal troops at all, or is it just commanders?

And I imagine it does provide good spell backup, but I'd be seriously worried that something would take out your Seithkonur before they can start volleying. I assume you carry a SoS for that, but even so, how many rounds before you start 'firing'? Do you buff with protection spells first, or trust to no one getting to the Seithkonur?

[Huzurdaddi]

I simply don't see myself using, or hear of most others using, their cheap mages early in a combat role, or _any_ role other than researcher, bloodhunter, or (occasionally) cheap-item forger.

How about body etherial with Pythium's Theurg Acolytes? Pretty decent at the start of the game. You do pay with reduced research though.

[Blitz]

Okay, you're confusing me again... are you talking about Nether Darts (Evocation-7), or Nether Bolt (Evocation-4)?

Well you use one, then when you get the tech you use the other =)

Doesn't the feeblemind effect hurt normal troops at all, or is it just commanders?

Hurts everyone

And I imagine it does provide good spell backup, but I'd be seriously worried that something would take out your Seithkonur before they can start volleying. I assume you carry a SoS for that, but even so, how many rounds before you start 'firing'? Do you buff with protection spells first, or trust to no one getting to the Seithkonur?

Latergame I usually have a SOS with me (pretender forged). I usually give the seithkona 5 skeleton guards each, with just group protection cast on the lot of em.

[Nagot Gick Fel]

Originally posted by Scott Hebert:

quote:

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Originally posted by Nagot Gick Fel:
No wonder you had bad experiences with her. That should be 5-10 kills a turn after you've researched a couple levels in Alteration and Evocation.

If you want to get to Thunder Strike, sure she'll kill more people. That's Evocation-4, though, and as I said, we're talking about the first 5 turns.

Though, if you can tell me how to get to Evocation-4 by turn 5, I'm all ears.

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At the time you posted this I think it should have been clear to everyone that the Virtue's main damage dealer is S-H-O-C-K-W-A-V-E.

Although a bit of Alteration research helps too. Mainly for Mirror Image if you have air 5+, or Mistform if you haven't.