AI DEAD MATCH CONTEST!

[Cheeze]

I realize that the EEE are already doing well, but I wonder if they'd do even BETTER if the matches weren't 1 on 1. Their ultra-friendliness might prove even more dangerous in those situations. I've been in games where I've wanted to war with the EEE, but I had more immediate enemies, and those EEE are so darn friendly and so darn STRONG!!!

[Rexxx]

Originally posted by Master Belisarius:
But I'm using files that are currently in the download forum.
- EEE, United Flora, Namovans, Pyrochette and Aquilaeian: you can see them posted.
- Klingon, Romulan and Jraenar, from the Last posted God Emperor's AIs.
- Vikings, Toron, EA and Narn, from the Last TDM.

Anyway, I have not problems to post the AI files inside a zip (but without the *.bmp files), but tomorrow.

Please exclude the EEE. I'm altering most of the strategies due to new knowledge (from PvK) about "missile hunting" and how it can be avoided. Secondly after checking the savegames I decided to alter slightly the design creation and facility construction files.
I would like to have only the most recent of my EEE available, the one I'm currently using, that is. That's why I removed the download link in the Mod-forum some days ago.

[Tampa_Gamer]

Hi MB - great idea. Thanks for including my Dra'kol, but as Mephisto pointed out, I tried to keep them true to form as an Intel/Gas race based on their ancestors the Darlok so they would offer some variety in races. Anyway, if you do another series, I would not mind seeing how my revised Piundon AI from the TDM pack fare.

Thanks

-TG

[Master Belisarius]

Originally posted by Rexxx:
Please exclude the EEE. I'm altering most of the strategies due to new knowledge (from PvK) about "missile hunting" and how it can be avoided. Secondly after checking the savegames I decided to alter slightly the design creation and facility construction files.
I would like to have only the most recent of my EEE available, the one I'm currently using, that is. That's why I removed the download link in the Mod-forum some days ago.[/QB]

Ok, as you wish Rexxx, but think TerranC wanted to have all the AIs involved in the contest, not the Last Version.

[Master Belisarius]

Originally posted by Tampa_Gamer:
Hi MB - great idea. Thanks for including my Dra'kol, but as Mephisto pointed out, I tried to keep them true to form as an Intel/Gas race based on their ancestors the Darlok so they would offer some variety in races. Anyway, if you do another series, I would not mind seeing how my revised Piundon AI from the TDM pack fare.

Thanks

-TG

Hi Tampa! A long time without see you!
Ok, no problem, the next time the Piundon will be there.
But I have not included the AIs to my own taste! All the races into the contest were voted for someone.

[Master Belisarius]

Narn vs Jraenar.
The Narn defeated the Jraenar in less than 200 turns.
Here the link: Narn_vs_Jraenar_S3.zip

Now, I'm starting the game between the Pyrochette and EEE.

[ November 30, 2002, 14:44: Message edited by: Master Belisarius ]

[Master Belisarius]

Originally posted by Cheeze:
I realize that the EEE are already doing well, but I wonder if they'd do even BETTER if the matches weren't 1 on 1. Their ultra-friendliness might prove even more dangerous in those situations. I've been in games where I've wanted to war with the EEE, but I had more immediate enemies, and those EEE are so darn friendly and so darn STRONG!!!

Yep, as I wrote in the first post, the peaceful races will have some disadvantage with this system to run the contest... But run a large contest with games including more than 2 races, would be a nightmare.

I have an observation about the EEE: they have lots of fleets with a few ships. Think it's ok fighting against others AIs, but against humans doesn't look so good.

[ November 30, 2002, 14:54: Message edited by: Master Belisarius ]

[Master Belisarius]

Pyrochette vs EEE.
The Pyrochette has a better start than the EEE. But the EEE started to attack the Pyrochette planets with several small fleets, and then, changed the game to their side.
The Pyrochette had several fleets with the "do nothing" syndrome, and then at the turn 365, although think still they could fight and try to win, believe the EEE will win.
Turn 458.
The Pyrochette were able to control the riots, and start to re-construct their empire. Has started an offensive into the EEE territory, and are near in the numbers.
Turn 482.
Although the EEE control most the galaxy, anyway they're loosing by points. A loong and very interesting game.
Turn 500 and the Pyrochette won by points...
Here the link (a heavy file to download!): Pyrochette_vs_EEE_S1.zip

Want to comment a few things:
1) The EEE never used troop transports. Think this is a disadvantage.
2) The Pyrochette won, only because:
a) Were good keeping their Last systems and their planets without riots most the time.
b) Had a good management of the production, to surpass the EEE production, even with less systems.
3) Interesting, but the Pyrochette never won a fast game: Two times at the turn 350, one time at the turn 450 and two times at the turn 500.
4) Sometimes the hardcoded AI behavior is very frustrating... The "do nothing" bug in the fleets or the lack of skills that has the Population Minister to send population to planets without people, or the lack of skills to decide the right targets, can change the course of any game.

Finally, I'm starting to feel myself ashamed and afraid: my two AI's had won all the games... and think that somebody could start to believe that I'm doing something to help them to win...
If somebody feel something like that, I have not problems if this person want to run the games where my AIs are involved.

[ November 30, 2002, 22:54: Message edited by: Master Belisarius ]

[Rexxx]

Originally posted by Master Belisarius:

I have an observation about the EEE: they have lots of fleets with a few ships. Think it's ok fighting against others AIs, but against humans doesn't look so good.

MB, you're right. The EEE prefer more but smaller fleets to a few (very) large ones. Large fleets are very powerful but you can only attack one or two planets - sometimes even in the same system - at the same time. Small fleets are less powerful but you can attack much more planets (if the AI has a good day even in different systems ).
In a "normal" game you frequently face more than one enemy, more than one or two enemy fleets. IMO the best answer to these multiple threats are more but smaller fleets.
I agree that larger ones are more dangerous to a human player. However, normally your AI don't face the human opponent at first, the probability of running into a hostile AI is much higher. You're also right, that - in a normal game - this "more fleets strategy" works quite well against other AIs, especially those with large fleets. Thus, it raises the chances to reach midgame at all and not being killed early. In midgame (it means for me being able to colonize rock planets) the EEE I'm currently testing begin to build up larger fleets in their desperate attempt to be a worthy opponent for the human player.

The situation in this contest is quite different. There is only one enemy to be crushed and for this purpose large and powerful fleets are much better. I'm surprised that the EEE survived so long against your Pyrochette.

This fleet thingie is like the quadrature of the circle, there is no perfect answer. The only solution I can imagine would be the ability to control the structure of our AI fleets, that would boost the qualities of any modded AI and make them a much better opponent.
As it is now I like the fact that there are different approaches regarding those "fleet strategies", it protects the game from getting too easy and predictable for the human player. What seems to work well against the EEE might be useless against the Pyrochette. Bad luck... Reload or start a new game...

EDIT:
Hi MB: Just read your Last post. Bad news, very bad news .
Controlling most of the galaxy and losing at the same time is hard, very hard indeed.
Looking forward to checking the savegames. I guess the EEE - stubborn as they are - build unit upon unit, not realizing that these efforts don't increase the score.

[ November 30, 2002, 22:53: Message edited by: Rexxx ]

[Master Belisarius]

Originally posted by Rexxx:
This fleet thingie is like the quadrature of the circle, there is no perfect answer. The only solution I can imagine would be the ability to control the structure of our AI fleets, that would boost the qualities of any modded AI and make them a much better opponent.
[/QB]

Good points, and agree 100% with you... Probably, I'll change a bit, the fleets.txt for the next Pyrochette/Aquilaeian Versions.