New nations extremely well crafted and enjoyable

[Wrana]

Considering power inflation - it is unfortunately not restricted to AD&D... But Dominions particularly seems to suffer from it less - partly due to patch fixes later (look at Helheim nerfs).
And while I wasn't a big fan of a whole Gath idea (I look up to EA/LA Machaka & Vanarus much more), it turned out fairly good, though very powerful.
As for Eriu & Tir na n'Og - they probably didn't make such big impression due to the fact that idea was present in Dom2 for a time, aren't they?

[Aezeal]

magic the gathering.. not played it in a while but that was the pinacle of power inflation IMHO

[Chris_Byler]

Yes, Tir na n'Og/Eriu and LA Pythium were already in Dom2 as special themes, so it was nice to see them again but that's probably why they didn't make the same kind of impression as Lanka, Fomoria, Bogarus or Hinnom/Ashdod/Gath.

I'd like to see an EA and LA Machaka, too. I think someone has modded an Anansi pretender, which would be a cool option for them. (At one time I had an idea for a Dom2 Machaka special theme where the hunter spiders had become extinct and the Machakans started animating their corpses to become something like the onyx amazon nightmares, with bane fangs instead of poison. I never actually made the mod, but it would fit the overall LA theme of decline and ruin.)

[Tifone]

I want to join the people who thank the devs for the new nations. their flavour is good and they look really cool. about their balance there are some little doubts i.e. in Baalz's HINNOM EATS EVERYTHING thread but still the nations are absolutely worthy ^_^ Tnx very much guys!

[Baalz]

Tifone said:
I want to join the people who thank the devs for the new nations. their flavour is good and they look really cool. about their balance there are some little doubts i.e. in Baalz's HINNOM EATS EVERYTHING thread but still the nations are absolutely worthy ^_^ Tnx very much guys!

I'd like to point out that I myself have not called for a nerf or change to Hinnom, I quite like them and think they're a bit analogous to an EA version of LA Ermor. These are the children of Gods...if you don't gang up on them and make special plans to deal with them expect them to become practically unstoppable. I love the diversity in this game, that even completely unscripted multiplayer games can turn into quasi-scenarios where nations try with varied success to put aside their differences long enough to keep the undead from killing the world or to break free of the yoke of the old gods.

[Gandalf Parker]

Actually I must disagree with this thread. (dont flame me yet)
Everything has its pros and cons. I returned to Dom3 recently to update community offerings I had that were still getting alot of download. I tried to test some changes just to make sure everything worked with the updates.

Have I finished? NO
Have I fallen out of Dom3 again? NO
The problem is that my short little tests have turned into full blown games that I cant give up playing again. The new changes have re-hooked me on the game.
As I said, everything has its pros and cons.

[JimMorrison]

Omnirizon said:
I think the new nations benefit from the power inflation phenomenon (I just invented that term seen in all gaming...

In MMO circles, the term used is MUDflation, since in MUDs and MMOs you see the most rapid and blatant inflation, due to people devouring all the content, and then begging for more.

As has been stated above, the devs do seem to be doing a good job with the relative strengths, as in a game that has end points, there is no need to inflate the system at all. I'd wager that if in the next month or so the new nations start to win a suspicious % of their games, that there will be an alteration of their strengths/weaknesses to bring them more in line with the rest of the game. As it is, there's enough feedback I wouldn't doubt a small change already, but there may be hesitation to see how well they actually mesh in MP first.

I have to say, I took over LA Gath in KingMaker, and while I have interesting options and strengths to exploit, I cannot see how anyone could possibly call them overpowered. Ashdod is a little stronger in my eyes, but most nations look stronger to me in their MA incarnations. Hinnom is a beast, and I can see small changes being reasonable - but they really do pay for their early game advantage with a challenging struggle to the late game, due to difficulty exploiting research, difficulty effectively blood hunting while eating everyone, and difficulty having the scales needed for late game while gaining the bless desired for early game.

I think MOST (not all, just most) of the people who refer to Hinnom as "too strong", have mostly only seen them in the early game, and haven't seen how their weaknesses become more and more apparent as the game progresses.


And wow, this is sort of OT, grrrrr. I just wanted to express my own appreciation of the new content as well. The great thing - to me - about new nations, is you don't even have to play them in a game to benefit from the addition, as interacting with them as an opponent adds just as much to the variety and enjoyment.

<3

[Saulot]

I have to concur with Sombre, there is definitely a creeping up effect in terms of a growing appreciation for the nation and it's atmosphere, as well as an ever increasing quality of the nations themselves. None of the newer nations are dry in terms of sprites, descriptions, spells, heroes, etc.

Lastly, like a fine work of art, they don't have that feeling that something is missing.

[sector24]

Did the other "appreciation" thread get deleted or something? Don't make me go to YouTube for entertainment!

[Gandalf Parker]

Being a MUD admin almost from their birth I have some experience there. MUDflation is a well known phenomenon. To break down some of the many MANY discussions amoung MMO admins..
there tend to be 3 types of "fixers" in MMO gods. Additive (keep making more and bigger armor and euqipment, then fix that with more and bigger monsters). Subtractive (or nerfer) which goes the other direction. And Balance who tries to trim both top and bottom but can look like a person trying to make a perfect circle by cutting a piece of paper taking snips off until they end up with a dot (their balance efforts meet in the very bland middle).

The best results IMHO is that this is one subject where committee works. An MMO head who is willing to hire without giving in to personal feelings about additive, subtractive, and balancer. But is willing to hire them all and allow them to do continual "battle" in the code allowing the game to go up and down continually.

On the other hand I am AMAZED at how well this game does with so few developers. Not just because they are doing all the work, but because they seem able to not give in to being just one type of fixer.