Boot Camp - Finished - Soyweiser/Jotunheim wins!

[Valerius]

So, does everyone agree that Jotun has won?

[DragonRider]

I actually kind of take it back. I have at least one thing left I have to try. Something I wrote off as pointless a long time ago but which might actually be workable via methods that I came up with after making that post. It's just really frustrating smashing your face against the brick wall of a hard turtle strategy over and over and making very little progress. Especially when Burden of Time is up after being dispelled once and your youngest national mage of note is age 45 out of 46.

The thing is that I almost never get retaliated against no matter how utterly my attacks fail. Jotunheim's got very little besides vampires in the area (hundreds and hundreds of vampires with over a dozen lords, mind you), which means he's totally unwilling to use them against my dominion. So my loss condition, basically, is to get strung along for eternity with loss after loss until some point in the distant future when Jotunheim's blood economy has carried them so far that they actually have something to invade with (possibly after controlling every part of the world except mine). So if Jotunheim wins it'll certainly have to be through a surrender rather than true conquest, but I don't really know when it's appropriate to give up.

Being left completely alone gives you lots of time to try different stuff, but there has to be a limit to what I can hope to accomplish somewhere. I just don't have the experience to see where I should draw the line.

[Pjoo]

Originally Posted by Valerius

So, does everyone agree that Jotun has won?

I still have a chance, don't I?

Well, anyways, I am having fun time holding on to my 3 castles, 2 of them under siege, spamming arouse hunger on the one without lab, etc. Turns take around 3min each. Don't see myself dying off anytime soon either, my "NAP" with Jotunheim and Shinuyamanese unwillingness to come take more earthquakes in the face seems to have reduced intrest in me. Now if I just can get rid of these temples...

If you get the other three to agree on a winner, I'll agree with that too then. I can't do anything, neither do I have scouts or anything else to figure out how the war is going.

[Groundworm]

I personall have no problem declaring Jotunheim the winner. It's possible that Marignon and I may gave made a dent in his empire, but not much of one. He also grows stronger while Marignon's forces wither and die and I have... vine men.

That being said, if we don't close the game, may I have a 24 hour extension on this turn? Thanks.

[Valerius]

Sure, hosting postponed 24 hours.

I guess we'll continue a bit longer to give DragonRider a chance to try his idea? If that doesn't work out and he concedes then it would be unanimous (and I assume Soyweiser would also go along with the decision ).

[Soyweiser]

Well, I do think you guys overestimate my troops atm. But I do have around 10 vamp lords, and 300 normal vampires. A lot of skrattir, some heliophagi. Of course BoT is reducing the amount of slaves I get each turn. I did lose most of my army vs shin. But I also stopped his.

But totally do not know your positions. Currently I'm just fighting defensive, anything under my dom is mine. And vamps keep it that way.

But I can wait it out, just sit there and let all mages die, and summon troops with empowered vamps to crush what little remains. And lords can always just summon one vamp each turn.

[DragonRider]

In order for me to take your capital (which is more or less the only way to stop the madness with the vampires), I need an army that can survive against 300 vampires and a dozen vampire lords at least four times in a row without reinforcements, plus dealing with whatever the Skratti might throw at me, and recent evidence suggests that I can't even come up with a force that can survive against them ONCE. I can't use SCs or they get banished, I can't use hordes of troops or they get Niefel Flamed (on top of whatever the vampire lords decide to do to them), I can't use communions because Burden of Time makes it impossible to keep more than a dozen or so mages alive at once (and most of that number wouldn't even survive the march). And you have more and more vampires every turn, probably. It's a pretty discouraging position to be in. Especially since I have absolutely no idea how many death gems you have, and therefore how many times you can recast Burden of Time even if I manage to dispel it again.

I'm not close to LOSING, since you don't have anything even vaguely capable of taking a fortress outside of your dominion (which has been true at basically every stage of the game since it started), but unless I can come up with a magic bullet to deal with those vampires it's mathematically impossible for me to ever win, so I have to figure you'd be able to beat me eventually, somehow. And it wouldn't be terribly fun playing for months and months with nothing happening waiting for that shoe to drop. So I'm pretty much at a loss for what to do, except for one or two remaining plans (which I don't have all that much confidence in, really, but I'd just be playing into your hands if I gave up early).

[Groundworm]

Apologies, but I've been stuck working long hours these past few days. Could I have a 24 hour extension, please?

[Valerius]

Sure, hosting postponed 24 hours.

[Groundworm]

I think we should reconsider ending the game and declaring Jotunheim the winner. For real this time. My army is a shambles and what few mages remain to me are slowly withering. I have little income, and I can't spend the gems I have because I need my mages leading my vine men into combat. In short, I have no real way of offering any further resistance. All the while, Jotunheim keeps summoning more and more vampires to replenish his armies on my border.

I feel like I've fought as well as I can, but I don't really have anything more to offer up.