Finite Resources + Proportions Mod ?

[Zar Alexej III.]

Hi there,

to all MODders.
So after trying some of the MOD out there, I definitly like that PROPORTIONS Mod,
but the Problem I have that I also want to play with
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FINITE Resources
COLONIZE only own Environment and breathable.
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So I use that MOD
http://g2.latibulum.com/pvk/proportions/

http://www.dogscoff.co.uk/neoexpansiondownload.htm

http://www.dogscoff.co.uk/files/Prop...alResponse.zip


SO when you play with that game settings, but also without MOD, many of the FACILITIES make no sense.
But in my opinion, the game would be a lot more strategical/tactical when you also have to look at the resources and for what to spend and recycle them. Now it is only, get more income as you have expenses and mining makes few sense.
Special with that MOD I couldn't even produce with all my planets enough ships that the maintance is higher than my income (maybe a lot later in the game)
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The Problem is when you turn on FINITE Resources, that some of the developed FACILITIES couldn't handle that finite resources, as they change always % values.
Like:

Name := Resource Converter I
Description := Massive molecular converter which can transform resources to different types.
Facility Group := Resource Extraction
Facility Family := 30
Roman Numeral := 1
Restrictions := None
Pic Num := 1
Cost Minerals := 6000
Cost Organics := 6000
Cost Radioactives := 6000
Number of Tech Req := 1
Tech Area Req 1 := Resource Manipulation
Tech Level Req 1 := 1
Number of Abilities := 1
Ability 1 Type := Resource ConVersion
Ability 1 Descr := Converts between resource types with a 50% loss of material (only 1 facility per system effective).
Ability 1 Val 1 := 50
Ability 1 Val 2 := 0

This didn't work, how could this changed that it reduces one resource and convert it to another one. SO we would need also all different possibilities ?


OR that one:

Name := Value Improvement Plant I
Description := Massive planet reprocessors which improve the value of a planet.
Facility Group := Planet Modification
Facility Family := 43
Roman Numeral := 1
Restrictions := None
Pic Num := 54
Cost Minerals := 10000
Cost Organics := 10000
Cost Radioactives := 10000
Number of Tech Req := 1
Tech Area Req 1 := Planet Utilization
Tech Level Req 1 := 4
Number of Abilities := 3
Ability 1 Type := Planet - Change Minerals Value
Ability 1 Descr := Improves the mineral value of the planet by 1% each year.
Ability 1 Val 1 := 1
Ability 1 Val 2 := 0
Ability 2 Type := Planet - Change Organics Value
Ability 2 Descr := Improves the organic value of the planet by 1% each year.
Ability 2 Val 1 := 1
Ability 2 Val 2 := 0
Ability 3 Type := Planet - Change Radioactives Value
Ability 3 Descr := Improves the radioactive value of the planet by 1% each year.
Ability 3 Val 1 := 1
Ability 3 Val 2 := 0

It should increase the VALUE and not % as it didn't work, when you use FINITE Resources.


AND THERE ARE A LOT MORE FACILITIES, which someone would need to work properly for FINITE resources, because there it would make sense. NOW THEY WORK FOR INFINITE, but there I don't need them.


SO PLEASE COULD SOMEONE TELL ME HOW TO CHANGE THIS (% to something else) OR IS SOMEONE SO SMART AND ALREADY KNOW HOW TO DO IT ?

Or is there no chance that the game engine could handle this ?

Would be nice for some feedback
Thank you

[ July 14, 2004, 09:35: Message edited by: Zar Alexej III. ]

[Alneyan]

You cannot alter the effects of these facilities within the game engine; but it isn't needed either. The resource converter allows you to convert resources already in storage, and so would be used to convert, for example, these organics into minerals. You would extract the organics, and then convert them, virtually increasing the mineral value for your planet (at the expense of organics).

The Value Improvement Plant works as well under finite games; while it adds its value to all planet values in infinite games (going from 150% minerals to 151% for example), it multiplies the *current* value of your planet in finite games. For instance, if you have 1500 minerals left on your planet, using the same facility will multiply these 1500 by 1,01 (making 1515 minerals). So this facility is paramount in finite games, and should be built as soon as possible given how it works.

I do not believe that Proportions is truly designed for playing finite games though (unless the author, PvK, did a lot of work to make the AI work in such games). If you would like to play finite games where the AI can handle its own, the AI Campaign mod is very likely your best bet. It is based on the Proportions mod, and aims at making the AI a lot tougher (including when playing with finite resources). I will let the author, JLS, to speak for his mod and how it plays with finite resources though.

[Zar Alexej III.]

Okay THX,

will have a look at this MOD you mentioned.
Wish you a nice day

[PvK]

Yes. The facilities you mentioned DO work in finite resources mode. It might not be easy to see their effects without looking at the numbers from turn to turn, though.

However, Proportions was not written to work with finite resources. The kinds of changes I made do not lend themselves well to that, because to my mind, planets do not just "run out of minerals" in the course of a few years. Instead, they can be abused to reduce the ease of resource extraction, but the mechanics and time scale aren't so easy to do. Moreover, although you might find a lot of "minerals" on a planet, and despite some very optimistic high-tech sci-fi to the contrary, you can't easily make starships out of minerals from scratch. Therefore I made the homeworld cultural centers produce many more resources (representing the yields of established native-environment high-tech infrastructure and supporting society). In limited resources (which I did at least jack up a bit), this means depleting the homeworld. Perhaps though the numbers could be tweaked to make the homeworld sustainable, but I didn't do this because it seemed too simplistic and not really appropriate.

And, the AI is entirely unprepared to use limited resources. JLS has made a strong effort to overcome the AI weakness, though, in the later AIC Versions, so that would probably be the best bet for what you're looking for.

PvK

[QBrigid]

And, the AI is entirely unprepared to use limited resources. JLS has made a strong effort to overcome the AI weakness, though, in the later AIC Versions, so that would probably be the best bet for what you're looking for.

This is not just Proportions or other MODS the AI does not handle Finite Resources that good in stock se4 either.