Brilliant Idea to make Indies More Interesting

[Saber Cherry]

The indies in Dominions II are really neat, and one of the things that make the game deeper and less predictable than, say, MoM, MOO, Populus, AoW, and the like. But they could be made much more fun and interesting, without much trouble.

This is something that can hopefully be added to the game engine - the ability to vary scales across the map, using factors other than the God's domain. Currently, special sites affect the local scale of some provinces. However, the map would become a more dynamic, less homogenous landscape if local scales were affected by indy populations, as described below.

To be very precise, independant civilizations do not have god-like scale-tipping power. However, certain types settle in places that are suitable to their physiology - for example, cold-blooded lizards choose locally warmer provinces, and cold-loving Raptors choose colder ones. On the other hand, Feudal societies (Knights and Longbows) imposed order on their citizens, while the concept of order being desirable just confuses barbarians. Merfolk only occur in highly magical environments, and Amber Clan Tritons have developed means of adapting the materials available underwater for efficient use.

Scale Modifiers by Indy Population:

Druid: +1 Growth
Barbarian: +1 Turmoil
Feudal: +1 Order
Garnet Amazon: +1 Heat
Onyx Amazon: +1 Death
Crystal Amazon: +1 Magic
Merfolk: +1 Magic
Amber Clan Tritons: +1 Productivity
Lizards: +1 Heat
Raptors: +1 Cold
Ichtyid: +1 Sloth (not good with tools)
Hoburg: +1 Luck
Others - Human non-feudal, Tribal, Atlantian, Triton, Jade Amazon: Neutral.

Scale Modifiers by Terrain Type:
(Note: Does not affect capitol provinces)

Mountain: +1 Cold

Also, I would love for the "Province Info" screen to add space for a description of the indies living there, and of course support for added text. An example would be:

Oaklands (27)

Feudal Society

Serving their liege lord, knights frolic about this land jousting, slaying dragons, and imposing order on overworked peasants. The population is kept safe from evil target-bearing haystacks by the keen eye and steady arm of longbowmen. When trouble threatens, knights and longbowmen may be found in the sampling ale at the local tavern, while the townfolk are handed a spear and leather jerkin, and sent out to fight.

Scale Effects: +1 Order

(Scales)
(Dominion)
(Terrain)

Note that Illwinter has only to add the text-tag capability and the text will be supplied by eager fans

-Cherry

[ January 19, 2004, 05:02: Message edited by: Saber Cherry ]

[mivayan]

How does these scales interefere with the scales of your god's domain? (how does it work with sites today?)

What will the scales end up with if a heat3, magic0 race settles in province with 'natural' scales of +1 cold, +1 magic?

[Saber Cherry]

Originally posted by mivayan:
How does these scales interefere with the scales of your god's domain? (how does it work with sites today?)

What will the scales end up with if a heat3, magic0 race settles in province with 'natural' scales of +1 cold, +1 magic?

Currently, if a magic site says "Increases Heat" or "Increases Death", that is cumulative with the dominant scales. So... for example... if a magic site in a province under your dominion increases Heat by +1, and your dominion is Cold +3, then the province scale becomes Cold +2.

On the other hand, if your dominion is Heat +3, the province will stay at Heat +3. (Note: Personally, I'd favor a +4 to -4 scale system so that events and magic sites could tip scales off their normal limits).

I envision the independants and terrains affecting scales the same way as magic sites do currently.

Incidentally, one more indy scale effect:

Hoburg: +1 Luck

-Cherry

P.S. In answer to your specific question, the province's scales would eventually become Heat +2, Magic +1.

[ January 19, 2004, 04:49: Message edited by: Saber Cherry ]

[ExitJudas]

damn good idea there!

the possibility of giving each indy province some personality is god damn good. Illwinter. listen to this boy! It shouldn't be hard to implement this in a future patch.

[Keir Maxwell]

Very interesting. As social structures don't necessarily change when conquered I see merit in your suggestion.

Another idea to spice up indies would be having indie's start with their troops in a variety of useful, and not so useful, deployments. The character of indie bashing is so different from real fighting because you always know how the indie will be setup. Changing this could be spicy and would probably go best with the upper levels of difficulty.

Cheers

Keir

[Arralen]

Why not turn it the other way 'round?

Terrain -> Scales -> general Indie Type -> randomly selected Indie -> re-adjustment of scales

A.

[CayseP]

Great ideas to make a good game better! Keep it coming and we can keep our fingers crossed that it is included in a patch

[Wauthan]

Good idea. Now we just need more Versions of independants to allow for more Versions of scale adjustments.

Could get very interesting since holding a province will get a lot more important if the scales are "Right".

[ExitJudas]

does magic sites influence the kind of independents in a province?

It would be sweet if you could use the independents as a barometer for what kind of magic sites might be in the province (hmm i wonder what 3 air mages are doing in that mountain province, might they have a secret lab or maybe a cave with air gems?).

Everything that makes the fantasy world look more alive and coherent really adds to the ambience and lets you create stories when you play.

[onomastikon]

Very good idea.
What about some "mundane" indies with drain +1?
Could some have +/- 2?

It would be sweet if you could use the independents as a barometer for what kind of magic sites might be in the province

This could be problematical because of game balance issues; currently, your mage must search each province without knowing if she finds something.

[ January 19, 2004, 14:14: Message edited by: onomastikon ]