God in the gate

Valin · #1 January 22nd, 2004, 11:10 PM

Just started a new game as R'lyeh, and decided to try a new tactic in reguards to the Void Gate. I put a Kraken Pretender as my primary summoner hopeing that as a God he would have better luck summoning. Also, if he got killed they could call him back or use a ring of returning. Also if he went insane, his regenrative abilities would heal him so he could continue to summon.
-I was wondering if anyone has tried this with any success.
-Also, do Gods in the Gate have a good chance at summoning?
-And does every God get called back at the same rate, or do cheaper point Gods come back quicker. It only took me 5 turns with a few Starspawn to got the Kraken back.
BTW, this tactic has not gone very well so far. Turn 2, a horror attacked my God and after a long battle he was slain. The next turn my Starspawn summoned 3 Elder Things on his first try. So much for the all powerfull Kraken. Sigh...

"That is not dead which can eternal lie, and in strange eons even death may die."

Wauthan · #2 January 22nd, 2004, 11:24 PM

Bad idea. Only the R'lyeh priests have any real success with summoning. All other either go insane or get attacked. Or both. But you seem to have noticed this already. Most propably this is a safeguard to stop the summoning from giving R'lyeh a far too great edge.

Get that Kraken out into province hunting. It's a great Thug unit to hide your MindbLasting troops behind.

Taqwus · #3 January 23rd, 2004, 12:12 AM

Yeah, use Starspawn priests, or the Stargazer hero if you're willing to risk him. Safest approach might be to use an Astral-2 starspawn priest so he can cast Return (needs astral gems) and later on, prepare with Ritual of Returning. Defender acts first, and they can't kill you if you've already left.
God recall takes 40 points of accumulated priest level-turns.

Norfleet · #4 January 23rd, 2004, 12:20 AM

What doesn't make much sense is why the Void Lord and Lurker get attacked/go insane. Aren't they supposed to be native void creatures, and thus should be comfortable summoning there, and never go insane, even if they don't successfully summon anything?

Chris Byler · #5 January 23rd, 2004, 12:38 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Valin:
Just started a new game as R'lyeh, and decided to try a new tactic in reguards to the Void Gate. I put a Kraken Pretender as my primary summoner hopeing that as a God he would have better luck summoning. Also, if he got killed they could call him back or use a ring of returning. Also if he went insane, his regenrative abilities would heal him so he could continue to summon.
-I was wondering if anyone has tried this with any success.
-Also, do Gods in the Gate have a good chance at summoning?
-And does every God get called back at the same rate, or do cheaper point Gods come back quicker. It only took me 5 turns with a few Starspawn to got the Kraken back.
BTW, this tactic has not gone very well so far. Turn 2, a horror attacked my God and after a long battle he was slain. The next turn my Starspawn summoned 3 Elder Things on his first try. So much for the all powerfull Kraken. Sigh...

"That is not dead which can eternal lie, and in strange eons even death may die."

Gods don't have any improved chance of summoning, battles in the gate don't get your home province dominion bonuses (IIRC), and gods have a high chance of insanity on every attempt (compared to Starspawn priests and Cthugul the Stargazer).

So, in short, don't use your god in the Void Gate. Use Starspawn priests (5% chance of insanity per attempt), or if you have him, Cthugul the Stargazer (2% per attempt).

NTJedi · #6 January 23rd, 2004, 10:46 PM

So anyone who has conquered and killed Ry'leh shouldn't be using the void gate???

That's too bad other races can't use an astral mage after killing Ry'leh.

Norfleet · #7 January 23rd, 2004, 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by NTJedi:
So anyone who has conquered and killed Ry'leh shouldn't be using the void gate???

That's too bad other races can't use an astral mage after killing Ry'leh.

If you used enslave mind on a Black Starspawn, you'd have your own starspawn priest to try using in the void gate.

You could also try wishing for a Starspawn priest. Although you might get the Blue mage instead of the Black priest, since the Blue Starspawn has a lower unit ID. Maybe wishing for a Stargazer instead will get you better results.

Of course, if you're going to use wish, just wish for the damn Vastness already. We know that's what you REALLY want anyway.

Chris Byler · #8 January 24th, 2004, 02:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by NTJedi:
So anyone who has conquered and killed Ry'leh shouldn't be using the void gate???

That's too bad other races can't use an astral mage after killing Ry'leh.

You can, but there's a high risk of insanity (25% per attempt, IIRC).

On the other hand, you do still gain skill for attempts you survive, so if you can cure insanity, you can make some slow progress. The Chalice, Gift of Health, Arco priestesses, Fairy Queen; park any or all of those in R'lyeh's old capitol (priestesses and the FQ will need a water breathing item of course) and keep trying with whoever got out of Arkham this month.

Probably too expensive to be worthwhile, but you can do it.

It would be nice if there was an item that decreased chance of insanity in the void, that other nations could forge (even if it was an artifact). Perhaps Nethgul could have this effect (serving as a guide for its owner)? Anyone who conquered R'lyeh should have no problem coming up with the gems to forge it...

Returning/Ritual of Returning can protect you from being attacked by void monsters (as can bodyguards, less effectively), but they can't protect you from going insane.

Saber Cherry · #9 January 24th, 2004, 02:14 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Chris Byler:
On the other hand, you do still gain skill for attempts you survive, so if you can cure insanity, you can make some slow progress. The Chalice, Gift of Health, Arco priestesses, Fairy Queen; park any or all of those in R'lyeh's old capitol (priestesses and the FQ will need a water breathing item of course) and keep trying with whoever got out of Arkham this month.

Or most obviously, empower a Recuperating leader in astral... and give it shambler skin armor, of course... 50 pearls, 5 water gems for the ultimate summoner? Not bad...

Chris Byler · #10 January 24th, 2004, 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Saber Cherry:

quote:
Originally posted by Chris Byler:
On the other hand, you do still gain skill for attempts you survive, so if you can cure insanity, you can make some slow progress. The Chalice, Gift of Health, Arco priestesses, Fairy Queen; park any or all of those in R'lyeh's old capitol (priestesses and the FQ will need a water breathing item of course) and keep trying with whoever got out of Arkham this month.

Or most obviously, empower a Recuperating leader in astral... and give it shambler skin armor, of course... 50 pearls, 5 water gems for the ultimate summoner? Not bad...

Duh, how did I miss that one?

To bring this thread full circle, the Ancient Kraken is a recuperating leader, and can start out with Astral (if you pay for it at setup), and has no need for shambler skin armor. Although recurring insanity on your God is a bit of a steep price to pay...

What other recuperators are there that aren't national? Immortals recuperate, IIRC - maybe a Wraith Lord would make a good summoner. (Although IIRC the Void counts as neutral dominion like the Arena, so his immortality wouldn't protect him from being killed by void monsters).

Although it occurs to me - Gift of Health is only 40 nature, and it makes all your astral mages recuperate. Since recuperation can take some time, this may be a better approach than astral-empowering a natural recuperator (unless, of course, there is something that is both naturally recuperating AND has astral without needing empowerment - Pan with random in astral perhaps?)