Units seldom used.

[Wauthan]

Just curious if you fellers know a trick or two about some units I never find any use for. Since there's no such thing as a redundant option I was hoping you might save them from a "moddy" end. If you can not then perhaps you can make a suggestion on how to improve the units? Feel free to add your own comments about units you don't use.

Abyssia - Humanbreds and Salamanders. The former is simply a lite Version of the basic troops and the latter is way expensive for it's punch. They're sole saving grace is a two point move but what's the point of being speedy if you can't actually beat anything you catch up with?

Arcosephale - Slingers and Light Cavalery. Slingers are waste of gold, which explains why they make out your PD. Even with spellsupport shortbow archers beat the snot out of them. Light Cavalery is expensive, fragile and inaccurate. Even if they get around the infantery they can not take down the commanders.

Atlantis - Spearmen. Sure they are cheap but I rather buy 5 reefwarriors over 10 spearmen. The former might Last the battle atleast.

Caelum Return of the Raptors - Raptor and Ravenguard have so far failed to prove why I should ever buy these units instead of the basic troops. Even when modding I could not come up with a balanced idea to "save" them.

C'Tis - Militia, Falchioneers, Slave and Elite Warriors. Militia suffers from the ordinary quantity does not beat quality problem. Falchioneers die far too fast and kill far too little, much like the Slave and Elite Warriors. The other C'Tis troops are remarkably more useful than these.

Ermor - Preatorian Guard. I get a highfatigue unit with an automatic affliction. The fact that it's got high morale (if it doesn't start with Battlefright) doesn't do much for this oldtimer.

Jotunheim - Jotun Huskarls and Hurlers. 1 point better morale verus 3 points lower protection. If I'm short on gold and resources I'll go for javelintossers (who got the range of a bow). Hurlers do a lot of damage yes? But the range is so short they are usually enter melee before throwing boulders and if they do those highdamage stones knocks down your own troops at an alarming rate. Again I go for Javelineers. Or the coolest unit ever created, the Mooseriders.

Machaka - Milita and Spider Riders. Spider Riders are not worth the price of 5 regular archers nor do they have anything like the staying power of a Spider Knight. When do you build these?

Man - Militia and Slingers.

Marignon - You get three units with increasingly longer weapons. I can see the use of only one of them. What am I missing here?

Pangea - When do you build Revelers? I never found their use.

Summons - Soulless, when you can get longdeads that actually hit something? Corpse Construct, you get a really expensive Soulless for those precious airgems. Iron Pigs, well they're cute and all but a size three trampler isn't really worth the magic.

[Aikamun]

Praetorian Guard (Broken Empire): Only tested for ten turns, but afflictions were generated on only 25% of those recruited. They were worth the cost, especially with strategic move two and their high protection / defense. Someone else may have more accurate data on actual affliction rate over a longer period.

Aikamun

[fahdiz]

Originally posted by Wauthan:
Machaka - Milita and Spider Riders. Spider Riders are not worth the price of 5 regular archers nor do they have anything like the staying power of a Spider Knight. When do you build these?

Don't their spiders stay and fight after they're killed? I know they're not as beefy as the Hunter Spiders, but it's better than a poke in the eye...at least it has been in my very limited experience.

Pangea - When do you build Revelers? I never found their use.

They're the only Satyr that has anywhere near decent morale. I might throw a few into a squad of javelin-throwing regular Satyrs just to keep them from running away when something goes "Boo."

[Graeme Dice]

Originally posted by Wauthan:
C'Tis - Militia, Falchioneers, Slave and Elite Warriors.

You must not have played much C'Tis if you don't think that the Elite Warriors are useful. They are quick to build, have excellent morale and attack, are fast, and have two high damage attacks. They are one of the few units that C'Tis has that can punch through heavy armour.

Ermor - Preatorian Guard. I get a highfatigue unit with an automatic affliction. The fact that it's got high morale (if it doesn't start with Battlefright) doesn't do much for this oldtimer.

They do not all have afflictions, and most afflictions are not that bad when you only have one of them. They also have a broadsword and high protection, while the Triarius only have a spear.

Hurlers do a lot of damage yes? But the range is so short they are usually enter melee before throwing boulders and if they do those highdamage stones knocks down your own troops at an alarming rate. Again I go for Javelineers. Or the coolest unit ever created, the Mooseriders.

Hurlers do a base of 30 damage, so they can easily kill even Ulmish Guardians, but they are at their most useful against knights and other high-defense troops.

Marignon - You get three units with increasingly longer weapons. I can see the use of only one of them. What am I missing here?

Check the damage, attack, and defense Ratings on the units. Those -1 and +1 values on attack and defense make a great deal of difference.

Summons - Soulless, when you can get longdeads that actually hit something?

Soulless have 15 hitpoints, so they can often survive a single hit and cause the attacking unit to fatigue themselves. Soulless warriors have more durability due to their armour.

[Torvak]

Arcosephale - Slingers and Light Cavalery. Slingers are waste of gold, which explains why they make out your PD. Even with spellsupport shortbow archers beat the snot out of them. Light Cavalery is expensive, fragile and inaccurate. Even if they get around the infantery they can not take down the commanders.

Slingers are useless. I usually mod in some archers for Arcos

[Arryn]

Jotuns are expensive, both in gold/resources, and in supply. You get by far more bang for the buck with spearmen (or spear-armed huskarls if you're tight on resources) than hurlers. You can only afford to have so many Jotuns so you need to make each one count as much as possible. Hurlers behind the front lines aren't nearly as effective as spearmen *on* the line. Hurlers cost the same amount of gold as spearmen (while only half the resources) but their 10 protection (vs. 18 for the spearmen) and pathetic 5 defense means that you'll waste all that gold very quickly if the hurlers ever get in melee. They are simply a bad investment.

[Tricon]

Slingers are good patrolers.
Not a very redeeming use, I know... but at least they serve some purpose.

[Nagot Gick Fel]

Originally posted by Wauthan:
Abyssia - Humanbreds and Salamanders. The former is simply a lite Version of the basic troops and the latter is way expensive for it's punch.

Humanbreds still have a good use: fire-resistant strat move 2 bodyguards for your mages.

Caelum Return of the Raptors - Raptor and Ravenguard have so far failed to prove why I should ever buy these units instead of the basic troops.

The Raven Guards are expensive but have more punch than any other Caelum flier and aren't cold dependant. I find them useful.

C'Tis - Militia, Falchioneers, Slave and Elite Warriors.

Berserked falchioneers are rather good and deal serious damage. Elite Warriors are excellent with Mass Protection. Both have dual attacks and are the C'tissian regular troops I use the most.

Jotunheim - Jotun Huskarls and Hurlers.

I find Hurlers very adequate to crush knights with their boulders. You just have to very careful when deploying them.

Marignon - You get three units with increasingly longer weapons. I can see the use of only one of them. What am I missing here?

Flexibility and countermeasures. Greatswords vs heavily protected swordsmen (best of the 3 to deal with Einheres). Pikes vs low-prot spearmen (eg, Reef Warriors). Halberds if you need punch vs tough enemy with range 3-4 weapons (eg, Ulm's battleaxe infantry). And halberdiers are good at defending castles.

Summons - Soulless, when you can get longdeads that actually hit something?

More often than not you aren't given the choice. Eg, reanimation after battles or popkilling events raise Soulless only. And Soulless have 15+ hitpoints and Last longer than basic longdeads in a meatshield role. So if your ability to deal damage comes from another source than your lowly undead troops, Soulless may be better.

[PDF]

All nations : unprotected/badly protected light Inf (Cardaces, Satyrs, ...). Except as arrow catchers :eek ...
All nations : Lt Cav. Too expensive for its -limited- usefulness (even for patrolling)
Arco : "Heavy" Cav, not that heavy, no lance and expensive...
Pythium : Velites. Get something better, it's only marginally more expensive. Hastati : why get them when you can have Principes for 3 gold more ?

[Nagot Gick Fel]

Originally posted by Arryn:
Hurlers cost the same amount of gold as spearmen (while only half the resources) but their 10 protection (vs. 18 for the spearmen) and pathetic 5 defense means that you'll waste all that gold very quickly if the hurlers ever get in melee. They are simply a bad investment.

They're a good investment if you use them only for what they're good at. Spearmen have serious problems dealing with high defense high damage units, like knights. OTOH a single boulder can crush a knight flat.